FUBTS

Alright , the following podcast will not be possible without my amazing executive producers , Jonathan Kaplan , Russ Matkin , Ben Sherman , Ian A . Chapman , Barry A . Spath , Lori Elsroth , Michael Elsroth , J .C . Dingus , and America's favorite public defender , David Donnelly . Thank you guys so much for making this podcast possible . Enjoy it . Hey , I'm Matt , and this is a very special , "Abracababble." Alright , so normally this is a private podcast , a member's only podcast , but this podcast needs to go out to the masses , right? This is a very shareable piece of information . I have two very special guests with me today . I have a embattled magician , Garrett Thomas . Liar . And I have the judge of Foulas back on for the second time , Mike Close . Here come the judge . Here come the judge . Nice to be here , Matt . Thanks for having me . No problem . No problem . I'm glad to talk about this , and we're going to have some fun . So good to see you again . So no , it's good to see you , Garrett . And I mean , when we met at Foulas , we really hit it off , and you also struck me as an incredibly intense and passionate individual about magic , and I said this to Close privately , I said , you fit the profile of someone who usually refuses to come on Foulas . So with you hitting that profile , then for you to be snagged in a bullshit YouTube controversy is like the worst-case scenario for your personality type . The reason I did this is you really can't say anything about it unless you actually try it . Yeah , how dare I say anything? And man , you guys are doing such an amazing job . It really opened my eyes to really the benefit of a show like this . I came away with this new idea . There's nothing wrong with races , even though there were people out there that said that totally defeats the purpose of running . My problem is that there isn't other shows . I mean , you guys have a proof of concept that there's enough magicians out there to celebrate just performance magic . Right . And so it wasn't that the fact that your show is so popular makes it so that it seems like that's what it's all about . But the problem is there should be more magic shows out there . So you guys are doing a great job , and I'm glad to be a part of it . Well , good , good , good . So you had someone , I'm not even going to name them because I don't even want people to care that much , but you had someone put out an incredibly long and shittily made YouTube video taking you down saying that you did not actually fool pen and teller that you lied . And this is bothering you , right? Well , I want to make sure that I'm understanding everything myself . And I know I didn't lie , but I want to make sure that the underlying implication is that the judges were wrong . And I'm like , no , they have more magic knowledge than , you know , if you calculated the years amongst you guys , I mean , it'd be insane to say 300 years of magic knowledge . I'm not dead yet . And that's just close . That's just ancient close . They think that someone could just walk in and lie and get away with that . I know I didn't lie . I mean , I spoke my heart , but I was offended by them so blatantly not understanding the process . Okay . Well , Garrett , we're about to go to close for incontrovertible proof of what's happened . But I want you to understand that before we do , what country are you in right now , Garrett? I'm in the USA . I'm in Brooklyn , New York . So I don't know if you know how well incontrovertible proof does in the United States , but I'm going to let you know not well . It is solid . I mean , everybody counts their votes and everything is , you know , every vote matters . I don't know if you've seen data on mass or climate change , but I'm letting you know how well incontrovertible proof does in the United States of America . Okay . I just want you to know that before we go to close . Oh , well , this happens . What country are you in? I'm in the Great White North . I'm up in Canada near Toronto . Do you understand what I'm talking about here , Garrett? Do you understand what's going on? I am so close to the bottom of me over close is gone to where truth matters a little more close talk to us . All right . So let's talk about several things . First of all , it's really gratifying that FUELUS is as popular among magicians as it is . I mean , I've been with the show since season two , which means I've worked on seven seasons of the show now . The one we just finished recording under COVID , we're actually calling season seven B , but it's still a full 13 week season with 52 magicians and 13 pen and teller hunks . But that's another interesting story . Lots of times and I don't do many magic conventions now and certainly not with the COVID situation but even before that I wasn't going out doing conventions . But when I do encounter magicians , they have lots of questions about why did this happen and why did that happen about a certain whatever performer it might be . And I always say to them , there's a story behind that . I can't tell it to you , but there is a story behind that . And mostly what has happened and a lot of these come from the early years from season two , three , four , pretty much , maybe five , is that full less is an evolving thing . And it's an evolving thing because we have no precedent for full less . I just did an interview on my news that will be available through my newsletter . I did an interview with Andrew Golder and Lincoln Hyatt , two of the executive producers for the show . And suppose you're doing , you think you can dance , that show . Well the judges of that can say to somebody , your plie was terrible and that doesn't give anything away . But in full less , we have to convey that information without giving anything away . So we walk this crazy tight work of being able to let a performer know that they know while at the same time not giving too much away to the audience . You don't mind giving a little bit of hints to people who have a serious interest who might want to Google some stuff and track down some stuff and learn about magic . And that's a great thing . That's all well and good . We like that a lot . So I can't go to any old magic book or any magic magazine and see how to solve full less problems by something that has been done in the past because there is nothing like this show in the past . And what that means is that as the seasons have progressed , we've been hacking through the jungle with our machete's , finding the clearest , smoothest path to getting the job done . Several things have evolved over the years . Things were really chaotic at the beginning of full less like in season two . We had guys showing up for their first rehearsals and saying to me , well we have three ways we can do this trick . And I'm thinking , well it's a little late for that , don't you think? We're here in Vegas . I thought you would have figured that out before you got on the airplane . And so there was that amount of chaos . What I will refer to now is the part where Penn talks to the performer . I will refer to that as the bust . Regardless of how the conversation ends up , whether it's a fool or it's not a fool , I call that the bust . Well that has evolved over time . There was a lot of fog of war that went on in the early years with that . Because we weren't all working toward a common goal . Lots of times we were trying to come up with on the fly to craft the language that the performer would understand , coming up with those really clever things that we say . There were a lot of voices involved . There was Andrew , Andrew Golder , the producer , he's the other judge I will say . And then Johnny Thompson was there and then there was me . And most of the time I sort of kept quiet unless I could think of something to say because then you really get too many voices talking about this stuff . So as this has evolved , we have come up with a much better system for handling the bust in particular because we get so many acts from outside of the United States now , acts for whom English isn't even close to being their second language . And if you try to use clever word play to convey something to people who don't speak English , then all of a sudden you're bombing the wrong place . It's fog of war , it's horrible . And there's also this thing of this new generation we see younger people doing the show . And before Foulas , there was a very common language of magic amongst magicians who studied , especially the United States . These young guys don't have the same background because of the internet and everything else . That's true . And tell us in terms of trying to lay down hints and they're like , I have no idea what you're talking about . Yeah , if you mentioned slideini to somebody because they're throwing things in their lap and they have no idea who slideini was and their lapping technique reflects that , I just said that to make care it laugh . I only said that to make care it laugh . So this was a big problem . Now , for the people who don't know , this is an important aspect of this . Foulas does not edit to deceive . We do not edit the acts to make them more magical . We will edit for time , but we do not edit to deceive . That doesn't seem to be playing fair with the viewers . One of the things that gets edited for time is the interview where Allison talks to the performer . If you were there live watching this happen , that can go from anywhere from five to ten minutes long . And while that's going on , that's when Penn and Teller are deliberating and trying to figure out how the trick was done . It doesn't happen in the 45 seconds that shows up on TV or the minute . It's a long time . So now let me explain what happens during that time . Andrew Golder and I are listening to what Penn and Teller have to say until they get to the point where they have decided on a method . We think the performer did this . That's the first time that Andrew and I then talk . Now in the years past , we were not particularly as explicit enough in terms of what Penn needed to do to convey this . But here's the important thing . At that point , when Penn and Teller say , "This is how we think this works," that's where the judgment happens . The judgment of whether an act fooled or didn't fool Penn and Teller does not happen during the conversation with Penn . Nothing the performer is going to say is going to change it . It's already been decided before Penn opens his mouth and talks to the performer . Because in this way , if Penn and Teller say , "Well , we believe you did it with mirrors." Well , if there weren't mirrors involved , then we say , "No , Penn , you guys are wrong . There were no mirrors involved . Let's talk about how we're going to bust this . What are we going to say about this?" But you're wrong . Right then , it's a fool . What happened in the case of Garrett , the liar? Here's what happened . Garrett wants to talk about this . He can . This method is a beautiful method for this trick with the ring . It is a combination of ingenious thinking and superbly executed sleight of hand . Garrett , do you want to talk a little bit about the method of your trick? Yeah . The way I would like to say is that it uses a solid ring and another tool that helps me create the illusion of melting the ring through the finger . There were always these things in play . There's nothing that opens up . There's nothing that's hinged . There's nothing that is gimmicked in any way . It is really just this inner play of the tools that are in my hands to create this illusion . So the important thing to note in that is there's a solid ring in play and one other thing . As Penn and Teller were analyzing Garrett's trick , their conclusion was there was only one object in play . The fact that Garrett had anything else going on went completely by them . As it did to me when I watched Garrett's video of this thing and watched him do it live . You've got to remember I see these guys either doing it with Skype now or I'm standing three feet away from them watching him do the thing and I couldn't follow what was going on . So the conclusion that Penn and Teller came up with was Garrett's using one object , a ring and that ring has to be gimmicked somehow . It must come apart . Something must happen in order to make this trick work . Well that's wrong . That's not the way this works . So the minute they came to that conclusion now we say to Penn and Teller that's not how it works . That's not how it works . So what happens next in the discussion? Well if the act hasn't fooled Penn and Teller then we have to discuss language that will convey that fact and that information to the performers so that they know what's going on . What's an interesting thing about this? In early seasons we try to come up with that under while the cameras are rolling and we would be talking what are we going to say , what are we going to say , how are we going to do this . Now I make notes on that when I see the act the very first time . When the producers send me the videos to say what's your assessment of this guy , in my notes I write all that up and I talk about how we can bust it . So it's not being left the last minute . So in case of Garrett's trick they thought that the one object that was in play because they thought there was only one was gimmicked . And so the conclusion was ask him that specific question because you have to understand no matter which way the bust goes whether it's a fool or it's not a fool we want it to be entertaining . And a very good way to handle the things when it's a fool is for them to ask a question which the performer can honestly say no . And since in the terms of Garrett's routine they had completely no idea that there was another thing involved . When they said to Garrett we believe that the ring you used was gimmicked . And I think they even pen even said we think you're using one ring and that ring is gaffed somehow . I could go back and watch it but I believe that's what they said . Is that right? Yeah , technically I have the quote here . The only thing we can think of is that you have a ring that's so carefully constructed to come apart in halfs either with a very strong magnet or with a shell or something like that that an audience member or even teller on very , very , very careful examination could not get the goddamn thing apart . Now if you have that ring gimmicked in any way we are not going to give it to you . If you did that in any other way with what would have to be pure sleight of hand we're not going to cheat and say okay it's sleight of hand because we did not catch you on anything . If it's anything other than a ring that comes apart you have fooled us . Okay , that's exactly they were fooled before they started talking to Garrett . They were fooled . I need to make that very clear to the people who don't understand how this show works . Before Pan opened his mouth to talk to Garrett the trick was a fooler and Andrew has alerted Dennis our director and said this is a fooler and they get all that stuff ready to go in the trophy to ring around . We knew it was a fooler before Pan opened his mouth because they were on the wrong track . See in here I thought I was just so persuasive with my answer . No , let me bring up another thing that's absolutely important here . For some reason Garrett had been using a method where that ring actually did come apart and he said no and actually did lie we would have shut that shit down immediately . That would not have aired . That would not have aired . We would have said what the fuck . And we would have shut it down . This is probably going to eliminate all your clients ever listening to this . I'm sorry . Everybody's like I want to go on full list . I know what I'll do . I'll fucking lie to Pan . Give me this trophy . Let me tell you something . It has happened . We have had guys on the show who did things in their performance and in the bust that we had never seen before for this very reason . So that guy is not a popular person among the Fool Us alumni . He's the one guy who managed to piss everybody off during the course of the fool . Sometimes some people anyway . But the point is if Garrett had lied about this , that performance would not have aired on TV the way it did . Yeah . Because this is not the way we play this game . It's a gentleman's game . And not only that , they were fooled before they started to talk to Garrett . So let me just say this . All I appreciate , the popularity that Fool Us has instilled and while I appreciate that it has caused a lot of young people and it's popular with women now and we're just reaching a very wide audience . It does the performers a disservice to reverse engineer what they have come up with . It's like when Guy Hollingworth figured out how to do the piece by piece restoration of a playing card that Copperfield originally did with the Honus Wagner card . Everybody thought that trick could only be done on TV . And I sat across a table from Hollingworth at a Chicago convention and he did that Mofo for me , piece by piece . And now what happens? What happens is this? Somebody has proven you can do it . Well , that's the jump . That's the intellectual huge chasm there is going , no , I figured this out . The reverse engineering is nothing once you know that somebody can do it . So with these performers that are on Fool Us , look , and Garrett will vouch for this . It is not easy coming on Fool Us . It can be nerve-wracking . It's a challenge . You're putting your ego on the line a little bit , especially if you're a guy who likes to fool people . You have to be able to accept the fact that the pen and teller are two really smart guys and you might not fool them . But we need quality magicians to come on the show because it does magic a service . Yeah . Well , trust me , it gets hard to convince a guy to come on the show if they think that the result of their performance is going to be the kind of bullshit they have to put up with as people try to reverse engineer things that they know nothing about . Now , personally , if this was an effect that I only did for myself , the way I approach magic in my show is to come at it honestly and just talk about , yes , it's a sleight of hand and I get to set up these conditions that you experience magic through . It's not that I'm doing anything supernatural and I always love presenting it that way . If it was just that , I would be fine with , you know , this would be cleared up easily . I would just expose how it's done on a YouTube video . But that doesn't hurt just me . It hurts everybody in the magic community . This is an effect that I have given the other magicians . They have purchased it and for me to need to explain how it's done to prove I didn't lie , will take away from the value that they have . So I had to find a way to come about this , to kind of brush this aside because I would normally want to just ignore this or just kind of address it head on . But here , there are other people involved . A lot of magicians that use this in their career , I don't want this to be something that hurts them . So that's really what this is about is clearing this up so that without explaining how it's done , let people know that they were still not correct . And I don't think you really fool Penn and Teller . They get one guess . I mean , the second guess , they would have had it . They are brilliant . But they also talk about how it's a feeling . Like Penn and Teller love their show . If it's just about the merits of breaking down tricks , it's not Penn and Teller figure out every detail . It's Penn and Teller full us . And Penn's always quick to stress that that full is an emotional word . They want to feel it . That's what they're excited about . They want to go like , whoa , that got bias . That's exciting . And that's the whole point of it . And that's the point of it for them . And that's what I say to guys , especially , and I won't get into this because this is a topic for another show , another conversation . But with the topic of red herrings , where guys think that putting red herrings into their tracks is the way to fool Penn and Teller , well , no , it's not . Because now you simply have a guessing game . And it gets much deeper than that . I'll just say it's partially Penn and Johnny Thompson's fault . Johnny Thompson helping out the first season magicians . And then Penn really publicizing the show the first time he went out to do interviews and stuff , talked about that as a thing . And Penn knew that that was a concept that an average person watching at home knew nothing on magic could buy into . But he was just pumping the show and not actually saying , this is how you should come on Fool Us to magicians . Well , you know , when I was a little kid , one of the tricks that fooled me to death was a trick called Hippity Hop Rabbits . And it's what in magic is called a sucker trick because the kids watching think that the two rabbits which change places under covers have an opposite color on the back . That the white rabbit has a black rabbit on its back and the white rabbit has a black one and you're just turning them around . Well , that's the red herring . That's the sucker part . But the thing is by the end of the trick , that method is proven incorrect when you actually turn the rabbits around and they're yellow and green . Now , that's a huge distinction . I just want to point that out . That's a huge distinction for a lot of people listening or practicing magic on this pod and or curious about magic performance . That concept is huge , close . That concept is huge . But here's the thing . The important thing to take away from that is that the incorrect method has been eliminated . You have closed the door on that . Now if I do a trick and there's five different reasonable ways that I could have accomplished it and I don't close the door on any of them , well then not only are Penn and Teller guessing one of those five , the audience at home is guessing one of those five because you haven't shut the door on any of them . And my other Canadian friend does a move in which he looks like he's deposited cards behind his collar as he rubs his elbow and says that he fooled Penn and Teller because he didn't do it that way . Well , that's what's the name of that program? Bullshit because you didn't eliminate that method from possibility . It's still in play . So that this is why I tell guys don't do red herrings . Not just because it's a bad way of constructing magic but it's unsatisfying for the average viewer at home . The person who doesn't know anything about magic , he goes , I think he did something there . Well then that guy's got to figure it out . It totally defeats the purpose of magic because right or wrong if there's an answer , it destroys astonishment . So if I had long sleeves on and vanished to coin and you walked away going , well , I went up his sleeve , well , it might as well have . And so there was no astonishment . So what's funny is a ring that opens up can't actually still move to the next finger . I mean , I don't even know how people imagine that a ring opening up could get to the next finger . It would have to be something else . It would have to , like Penn said , it would have to break apart completely which would actually not be as smooth as the trick was done . I don't think the trick could have been done with a ring that's gimmicked in that way . The way that he had suggested . And so if you think about it a little bit , even that guess doesn't make sense . But the point of magic for me is to give people astonishment which is no answer , right or wrong . I've avoided a lot of mentalism because people would say , well , I guess he can read minds . That's an answer . It's a wrong answer , but it's an answer . And I want mental magic . I want astonishment . I want to amaze them with thoughts and words and numbers and ideas , not convince them I can do something that I can't . So mental magic over mentalism takes it away from the guessing game of how it's done and just goes , I have no idea . There's no way . It can't happen and I don't know . And that's where astonishment lives . What if we said , and it's also just because we haven't said it with a fine point . So not only is the video incorrect about the lying and the fooling being somehow not genuine , they're also wrong about the method they expose in your act . Is that right? Yeah , absolutely . There is a moment where people are zooming in and taking a look and they , I would say that there's something strange that they're seeing , but they are totally wrong about what they're interpreting it . And so , you know , that is not a part of that's not me lying . It's just me creating this illusion . And there's someone saying they see a gap when it's actually the highlight of the ring or the shadow of the ring . You know , it's... Well , let me go this way . There's no gap involved . Best time going over the Zapruder film . Then they have looking at this freaking ring trick . That's what that's it . So that's what I want to say to you , Garrett . Okay , we've given you the time to put it out there . Yes . The amount of people that have watched my appearance on FULAS , the amount of Asinine theories that are posted on my YouTube clip that I delete , also correct theories that I post on my YouTube clip and delete because it's just so stupid to be like , "Meh , meh , meh , this." I didn't do the most complicated trick on FULAS . So when people really go into Asinine explanations , but then you look at the numbers of the amount of people who have enjoyed my clip , I mean , it is... It doesn't even get a slice on the pie chart . So where are you emotionally with this? Like where is your end point? Like you have to let this go at some... Oh , no , I am loving this whole experience . This is fun to me . The fact that some people are so lost that they have to think that I lied . I just don't want other magicians getting hurt . I don't want the integrity of FULAS being questioned that you could lie . For me , it's like... Well , that started with Eric and me . There's nothing you can do about that . Yeah . Is it magic about the lie that helps us understand the truth? Magic has got that intrinsically in it , but we don't lie to each other . We are open and honest to other magicians because we all have the common goal . We all have the same passion . So I am emotionally overwhelmed with how brilliant the whole experience was . Even people are saying a lot of more good than bad . I just want to make sure that this doesn't get any traction and something like this doesn't cause to question the whole situation . Well , that's fine . And I get that . And I want you to also leave this interview knowing that what you just spoke about , what's passionate about magic , you are delivering unbelievably well . You're a fantastic performer . Your videos and downloads and lessons are fucking awesome . And so... So I heard you wanted to take some classes . I do . I do . Yeah . I have your ring thing . I have it . I was wearing it . Yeah . One of the things that getting on television is you get a much wider... You cast a much wider net to people . So when you are , especially you don't do big feeders even , you like to do very intimate performances , there's a control element to that . There's a control element to... I always joke that the best kind of fame is author fame because either someone knows you're that writer and they think you're awesome or they don't recognize you at all in a supermarket , I don't know anything like that , no one bothers you at dinner . And so when you go on television , you get rid of that . So much more people think you're amazing . And then with that , there's people that you normally wouldn't control at all that now have access to you to say bullshitty things about you . And I'm just saying that I'm very happy we're clearing this up . But I also want you to see the actual scope of what you've accomplished . And this trolling thing is just a factor of this wider net you've cast . Yeah . It's a blessing no matter what . And there's no bad press anyway . As long as they spell your name right . It's important for the people listening to this and the people who enjoy FU lesson , the people who frequent the many , many YouTube channels where guys dissect the stuff that the performers are doing . I would simply suggest that they put themselves in the performer's shoes . Think for a moment the amount of work it takes to get on fullness . It takes a lot of effort . I mean , for the last for this COVID season that we just taped , I've been working since June working with guys on Zoom and on Skype and whatever , trying to make sure that everything looks as good as it can possibly look . Plus there's input from the producers about scripting . And then there's all this stuff that happens . It is a challenge to do it . If the result of that challenge is that all the little dogs embarking at your heels trying to rip their pants legs apart , why would people want to take part in this? So I would just say that it would be a much better effort to be supportive of those who take the risk , who go on the show and put their product out there , put their magic out there and be supportive of that because of what possible use is it to tear these other performers apart . You'd be much better spent buying a book , figuring out a trick and trying to get on the show yourself . Then you find out what all this is about . But it certainly does magic no good to dissect these performances of these great people who come on the show and give it everything they've got . I mean , you know , and Penn and Tella will point to being one of the drawbacks of Fool us that it has to be a fool or that kind of stuff . There's such a focus on methods . And that's something that's a thought that privately is something that drives Tella nuts . Like Tella is , you know , everyone who's listening to this podcast , hearing me say it to death , he says , "The secrets aren't important because they're amazing . The secrets are important because it would make something beautiful ugly to know them." Right? Like , if they were beautiful , then we would just put them out , put them out there . There's nothing to do with it . And so the idea that people could like , so even if you believe that dumb video , right , go ahead , go out there and get yourself a hinged ring and start performing it . Good luck . Good luck . You know what I mean? There's so much more . Or maybe you buy yourself a hinged ring and you come up with something brand new . Whatever it is . Whatever it is . Right . Do some fucking work . Do some fucking work . Read a book . Suffle a deck of cards . Think about it . Don't spend your time nitpicking stuff that's already been done . And the other one thing I wanted to mention and then I won't monopolize the conversation is yes , it's lovely if you can fool Penn and Teller . It is not easy . They are two very smart guys . But more important is to do an entertaining , amazing piece of magic for the people who are not magicians . Because that's what elevates magic . That's what makes all boats rise with that tide . Because people go , wow , that guy was really great . Penn and Teller knew how it worked . Well , they've been in it forever . They're really smart guys . So don't go on the show . I mean , here's the thing . If you want to go on the show to fool Penn and Teller , then the trick you have has to be a trick where as I watch it when I'm reviewing the videos , I go , I don't know how that works . Right . It's not that I can pick one of five methods . I look at it and go , I don't know how that works . And believe me , for the COVID season , we did six of them , at least a half a dozen , where I looked at it and I said , I don't know how that works . And whoever , who was the guy who came on with Spongeballs , the Spanish guy? Oh , yeah . I remember Julio or Julio . Yeah , yeah . Start with an X , I think . Yeah , it was Julio , yeah , yeah , I think . And I remember seeing it was the most amazing Spongebob routine I'd ever seen , but I'm pretty pretty much a lay person with magic . And so I was like , cool . That's just good TV . And that's the way this show works . I mean , and then he finished up and then closed set after her . She goes , that's a motherfucking fooler right there . And I was like , what? And he goes , that's going to fool Penn and Teller . And I was like , Spongeballs? And you're like , and Toni close was like , I'm telling you , that's the way it's going to go down . He's doing stuff . I've seen every Spongebob like there is . And he's doing stuff I've never seen . And an imposive Penn teller , I haven't seen it either . You know , and I'll also say with the producers of the show is , and I just , I watch it all time , they try to get the best magic on TV full stop . Once they had that list in their hands , I watch Andrew kind of go like , oh , and just kind of try to guess if there's going to be enough trophies or not for the season . But that is all done after the fact . So one of the things I like to tell people that it's called Penn and Teller Fool Us , not Fool Them . Yeah . You're supposed to , the only people that ever get fooled are the other magicians . The Iwano Amaze , the audience and Fool the magicians . Yeah . Only another magician would look at this as a puzzle . And only another magician should look at it as a puzzle . You know , if I gave you a crossword puzzle without the clues , no one would think less of you , you can't figure it out . This should not be an ego problem for anyone else , but another passionate magician who wants to decode this . So I love , you know , that it's Fool Us , not Fool Them . It's amazed the audience and we as brothers and sisters in the world of magic , we're going to look at this as a puzzle of how we can create these moments for other people . But everyone else , it's about amazing . It's not really about Fool It . And it's really a showcase show that I'm honored to be a part of . And I... What about your regular life , Garrett? You got on TV , you showed off your stuff , family and friends , watch it , how to go for you . Everyone's overwhelmed . Because of the COVID situation , I've taken a break from a lot of my performance venues . Generally , I would do a lot of local restaurants and clubs . Of course , that's all kind of changed and we're focusing on stuff on Zoom and things like that . But of course , you know , magicians approach that situation all wrong and they try to do magic tricks live on Zoom . And so I went to the drawing board and created something new and hopefully I won't have to do it forever . Hopefully I'll get back out there and I can't wait to come back to Vegas and spend some more time with you guys . Well let me just say I can't wait to tell somebody on YouTube tears your act apart , pal . I do have to say that for me , I haven't been as lucky as Garrett . My mother thinks I'm a pimp . If she knew I was a magic consultant , she'd be heartbroken . I think the funniest thing to happen is for Garrett to come back on Fool Us and Lie . That would be the funniest thing to do . Guys , thanks for coming on . Thanks for your attention . I appreciate it . Talk about this , Matt . Yes . Thank you . Well , we'll have to have you on again , Garrett , just to talk magic again . Of course , close . Yeah . Audience favorite . Your last interview , people just fucking loved it and so we got to have you back . And then happy to . There's lots of things to talk about . So thank you , Garrett . I'm glad we were able to do this . I really appreciate it . This was perfect . Yeah . Hey guys , thanks for listening . I also want to thank these amazing patreon backers and the popsicle that was an African battle . Smitty scoop . Duck Flambay , Jake Schneider , Wendy , Roger Taylor , Jason Horkasidis , Elizabeth A . White , Tipsy Scoop , Damian Regolado , Jesse Miller , Wendy Bumgardner , Dr . Scoop Little , Kristi Salinas , Greg Rekton , Daniel Matias-Farrar , Donald McDaniel , Angry McJingerbeard , Jason Yager , Ed Andrick , Jason Vasquez , Lee Elliot , Carmen Ida , Peter McDougal , Corey McTitts , Roman Jeff Loomis , Kimberly L . St . Aubine , Ice Cream Sunday Scoop , Luke Skywalker Richards , Luke Scoop Skywalker Richards , Luke Skywalker Richards , Luke Skywalker Richards , Luke Skywalker Richards , Jim Dunne , Uber Square , Jay Shapiro , Mike Wenz , Graham Forbes , Jim the first magician to make Penn laugh at his name , Kes Bryan Carter , Scott Mulderick , Ice Blue Scoop , Jeff Lizer , Ryan Walduck , The Lapis Lagomorph , Dan and Luke Mellon . Thank you guys so much , especially some of you who have been with me a really long time . I really appreciate it . [Music]