KarbonDallas/gist:d9723ea71be3c78c56d0b21150dbb20a

## gistfile1.txt
[12:43:03] <Guest48> ok cool, and do you guys get mad if I need help setting up znc on vps ??
[12:47:46] <Woet> Guest48: who is "you guys"?
[12:47:57] <Guest48> people using this channel
[12:48:10] <Woet> no, we do not get mad when people ask for help
[12:48:12] <rascul> what about the gals? do you not care if they get mad?
[12:48:26] <Woet> else daoenix wouldn't be here
[12:48:30] <Woet> he asks us for help with all the tickets he does
[12:48:41] <rascul> help me linux
[12:48:47] <rascul> how do i install facebook on my droplet?
[12:48:54] <gparent> apt-get install facebook you fucking retard
[12:49:05] <Woet> wow
[12:49:14] <gparent> do you need me to download ram for you too??
[12:49:32] <emilyrose> gparent: no need to be rude
[12:49:33] <rascul> E: Unable to locate package facebook
[12:49:34] <rascul> E: Unable to locate package you
[12:49:36] <rascul> E: Unable to locate package freaking
[12:49:37] <rascul> E: Unable to locate package retar
[12:49:52] <gparent> emilyrose: we're joking
[12:49:54] <gparent> lol rascul
[12:49:56] <Guest48> are free irc bouncer services secure?
[12:50:01] <rascul> no
[12:50:13] <rascul> znc is pretty easy though
[12:50:14] <gparent> I wouldn't call any bouncer service secure but they aren't insecure either.
[12:50:16] <emilyrose> gparent: it's still pretty unwelcoming to other people
[12:50:30] <rascul> gparent quit unwelcoming me
[12:50:50] -*- gparent sends mountains of chocolates and puppies to rascul with get well cards and happy birthday wishes
[12:51:01] <rascul> chocolate puppies?
[12:51:09] <Guest48> gparent : I'm wondering if to suscribe to DO or to get a free 5 network bnc from stormbnc....if I use ssl to connect to the bnc, the admins will still be able to read everything ?
[12:51:09] <gparent> emilyrose: ill take a pass on this one
[12:51:20] -*- Woet takes the chocolates
[12:51:46] <Woet> emilyrose: you're not welcome here
[12:51:46] <rascul> Guest48 only the connection to you and the server would be encrypted, the admins could potentially read what they wanted
[12:51:52] <gparent> Guest48: the operators of the service have a privileged place
[12:51:54] <Woet> emilyrose: if you are offended, please leave.
[12:51:56] <rascul> you can znc on a droplet and do other things too, all for $5
[12:52:04] <emilyrose> Woet: you are mistaken
[12:52:13] <Guest48> rascul: i just dont know what else can I use the droplet for apart znc ? any ideas ?
[12:52:21] <rascul> web server type stuff?
[12:52:24] <rascul> owncloud?
[12:52:28] <rascul> vpn?
[12:52:35] <gparent> Guest48: buying a droplet instead of using another's bouncer service removes one layer of the stack from having delegated trust
[12:52:40] <rascul> dns so your isp doesn't hijack yours?
[12:52:49] <gparent> but it involves one more layer of work..
[12:52:58] <Guest48> vpn to watch netflix us or Do is banned by netflix ?
[12:53:07] <Woet> emilyrose: this channel doesn't revolve around tiptoeing around peoples feelings, if people are offended or feel unwelcome that is their problem
[12:53:09] <rascul> well i guess you could do that
[12:53:20] <Woet> emilyrose: especially when it's simply a matter of using words like "retard".
[12:53:29] <rascul> vpn's are useful for all kinds of things, not just pretending you're somewhere you're not
[12:53:46] <Guest48> I guess DO doesn't allow vp to download torrents :P
[12:53:47] <emilyrose> Woet: interesting perspective
[12:53:50] <Guest48> vp = vpn
[12:53:54] <Woet> emilyrose: thank you
[12:53:56] <rascul> what's wrong with torrents?
[12:54:08] <Guest48> I mean, illegal torrents
[12:54:14] <rascul> illegal torrents are illegal
[12:54:15] <gparent> for what it`s worth my own opinion of it is that people who go out of their way to be offended by banter between friends aren`t high on my concerns list
[12:54:17] <emilyrose> Woet: so the part of the topic that mentions not insulting people is just there for show, then?
[12:54:33] <gparent> it's not.
[12:54:35] -*- rascul crosses gparent off his concerns list
[12:54:42] <gparent> we don't tolerate abusive behavior
[12:54:43] <emilyrose> gparent: I have no clue what your relationship is to the person you're insulting
[12:54:46] <Woet> emilyrose: direct insults that are not in banter? yea, that's not allowed
[12:54:54] <emilyrose> "banter"
[12:54:54] <emilyrose> haha
[12:55:02] <rascul> bantha > banter
[12:55:02] <Guest48> can we use a droplet like a ftp server ? for personnal stuff?
[12:55:03] <Woet> emilyrose: it's not up to you to decide whether rascul is offended of not
[12:55:08] <Woet> emilyrose: if he is then he'll say so
[12:55:08] <rascul> Guest48 sure
[12:55:14] <emilyrose> Woet: I haven't indicated that it was
[12:55:16] <rascul> but ftp is horrible
[12:55:16] <timekeeper> did somebody call rascul a buttface
[12:55:21] <emilyrose> Woet: but I appreciate your concern
[12:55:26] <Guest48> which plan do you recommend me ?
[12:55:26] <rascul> timekeeper get your face out of my butt
[12:55:34] <timekeeper> no
[12:55:35] <rascul> Guest48 $5 unless you need/want more
[12:55:45] <Guest48> that's in US dollars
[12:55:49] <Guest48> ermm...$7
[12:55:50] <Guest48> per month
[12:55:51] <emilyrose> I'm actually the one that's offended in this case
[12:55:58] <timekeeper> yeah, USD :/
[12:56:03] <rascul> $5 in freedom dollars
[12:56:03] <gparent> that wasn`t really the debate
[12:56:13] <emilyrose> there was a debate?
[12:56:16] <emilyrose> I must have missed it
[12:56:19] <emilyrose> all I saw was "banter"
[12:56:27] <gparent> trump came by
[12:56:27] <gparent> you should`ve seen it
[12:56:29] <gparent> real issues were discussed
[12:56:31] <rascul> emilyrose what was offensive to you?
[12:56:34] <Woet> emilyrose: https://i1.wp.com/theshake.com.au/wp-content/uploads/2013/07/offended.jpg - hope this helps
[12:56:55] <emilyrose> rascul: the use of the phrase "Fucking retard" in a community support channel
[12:57:09] <Guest48> why all your idendts are ~ and not your nick ? ex: gparent@... it's ~gparent
[12:57:20] <gparent> I dont run identd
[12:57:35] <rascul> i run identd
[12:57:35] <gparent> when you don't, the ircd may prepend that do your user
[12:57:39] <gparent> to*
[12:57:41] <Guest48> I see, and what's the advantage of running identd ?
[12:57:46] <gparent> none I can think of
[12:57:47] <rascul> emilyrose even though it was said jokingly and not directed at you?
[12:57:49] <gparent> except removing that ~
[12:58:03] <Guest48> ok
[12:58:05] <rascul> Guest48 that's literally the only use for identd in the context of irc
[12:58:05] <timekeeper> what was said?
[12:58:11] <emilyrose> rascul: all I know is that it showed up in my buffer and it was pretty upsetting to see in #digitalocean
[12:58:28] <Guest48> I'm still thinking it's expensive just for a bnc bouncer lol
[12:58:30] <Woet> emilyrose: then you should probably leave.
[12:58:44] <emilyrose> Woet: that's the second time you've told me to leave
[12:58:46] <gparent> I will sometimes be overly emotive in an attempt to humor, it doesn't happen that often that I use those words in public channels I don't think
[12:59:00] <Guest48> it only has 20gb of space, not much clouding there
[12:59:07] <emilyrose> gparent: do you think it's something that should be accepted?
[12:59:10] <gparent> honestly, I'd concern myself more about people who are actually abusive to others in here and point them out
[12:59:10] <Woet> emilyrose: yea, if you can't control your emotions and get offended by simple word usage not directed at you, it's not a good place to be
[12:59:14] <Woet> emilyrose: please stop wasting our time.
[12:59:17] <Woet> emilyrose: leave or deal with it.
[12:59:27] <emilyrose> Woet: I've chosen to deal with it, which I'm doing now
[12:59:35] <rascul> Guest48 only cool people like me run identd anyway
[12:59:42] <Woet> emilyrose: okay, deal with it by yourself and not by not wasting our time.
[12:59:45] <Guest48> haha
[12:59:53] <emilyrose> Woet: you're welcome to disengage from the conversation if you feel it's a waste of your time
[12:59:55] <Guest48> i wish I had my own server to get a free znc
[12:59:59] <gparent> emilyrose: I think it should be up to the called and the callee, and I think if I was being abusive for real others should pitch in and tell me so
[13:00:02] <Woet> emilyrose: final warning.
[13:00:13] <emilyrose> Woet: warning about what exactly?
[13:00:22] <gparent> about dropping this trivial issue
[13:00:25] <emilyrose> it's not trivial though
[13:00:26] <Woet> emilyrose: stop wasting our time, stop discussing this. drop it or leave.
[13:00:32] <emilyrose> and I'm asking for clarification on the moderation policy of the channel
[13:00:41] <emilyrose> if an op would rather PM me, that's fine too
[13:00:46] <gparent> it wouldn't be trivial if I was being abusive, which I wasn't.
[13:01:07] <emilyrose> so it's about intent?
[13:01:15] <KDDLB> emilyrose – this is an unofficial channel
[13:01:30] <emilyrose> KDDLB: that's pretty obvious :P
[13:01:39] <gparent> it's about intent to the extent that I know for a fact that rascul won't suddenly forget that I like him and he knows that 'facebook' isn't a package tracked by Debian repos.
[13:01:51] <gparent> so there's no possible way he could be offended
[13:01:58] <gparent> as for the rules, that is
[13:02:04] <emilyrose> gparent: so your assertion is that it doesn't matter if anyone else in the channel (501 other people) is offended
[13:02:07] <gparent> for your thing about offending words that's a different issues
[13:02:26] <gparent> that's not what I said
[13:02:30] <rascul> i'm still confused how other people besides me could be in a position to take offense to that
[13:02:30] <gparent> I'm explaining the rules
[13:02:32] <emilyrose> gparent: I'm asking
[13:02:36] <gparent> and I'm replying
[13:02:46] <gparent> you made up a conclusion to my reply which isn't true so Im saying so
[13:02:57] <emilyrose> gparent: thanks for clarifying
[13:03:43] <gparent> so the rules are meant to protect direct abuse, as far as I understand, not the personal beliefs of 501 different people
[13:03:51] <gparent> woet would split on actual problems
[13:03:54] <gparent> im not an op
[13:04:04] <rascul> wow i can't even count to 501
[13:04:13] <gparent> it's one short to where you can count to though
[13:04:14] <timekeeper> woet pls
[13:04:22] <gparent> just count yourself and then 500
[13:04:23] <rascul> so it's right after 6?
[13:04:44] <rascul> maths is so hard :(
[13:04:54] <timekeeper> its easier if you're azn
[13:05:06] <rascul> what's azn? is that like amazon?
[13:05:36] <emilyrose> gparent: so I guess I'm still confused
[13:05:41] <timekeeper> :/
[13:05:59] <emilyrose> gparent: I'm trying to understand how or more importantly *why* it's deemed acceptable to call someone a "fucking retard" in #digitalocean just because you know them
[13:06:00] <Woet> emilyrose: i warned you several times, you can discuss it in pm if you disagree.
[13:06:03] <-* Woet has kicked emilyrose from #digitalocean (Your behavior is not conducive to the desired environment.)

## gistfile2.txt
[13:06:35] * Starting query with woet
[13:07:00] <emilyrose> so am I to understand that you've banned me from #digitalocean for my concern over the use of offensive language?
[13:08:41] <Woet> no, I banned you for continuing to discuss something after you were told three times to stop
[13:08:52] <emilyrose> I see
[13:09:22] <emilyrose> so you've banned me for asking for clarification on a policy that didn't appear to be enforced?
[13:09:29] <emilyrose> even though I offered to take it to PM with an op?
[13:09:37] <Woet> you're taking it up with an op right now
[13:09:40] <Woet> i'll be happy to clarify
[13:09:46] <emilyrose> but you banned me first
[13:09:48] <emilyrose> why is that?
[13:10:03] <Woet> fairly certain that's how you do things too
[13:10:03] <emilyrose> I feel like my request to speak with an op directly was pretty clear
[13:10:07] <Woet> not sure why you have an issue with it
[13:10:20] <emilyrose> my issue is that someone was using abusive language
[13:10:28] <emilyrose> and it was me (the one who was concerned by it) who was banned
[13:10:43] <emilyrose> even though I remained completely calm and offered to discuss it in PM
[13:10:48] <emilyrose> which you've only done AFTER banning me
[13:10:53] <emilyrose> why was that necessary?
[13:12:59] <Woet> it was necessary because you continued to discuss something after you were told to stop it
[13:13:19] <Woet> you were specifically told that if you were offended or concerned by it, to either deal with it by yourself or to leave
[13:13:32] <Woet> you choose neither of those options
[13:13:54] <emilyrose> is that your response to everyone who expresses concern at hostile behaviour?
[13:13:58] <emilyrose> "deal with it or leave"
[13:14:06] <Woet> if it's not directed at that person, absolutely
[13:14:09] <emilyrose> interesting
[13:14:43] <emilyrose> Do you feel like this is an effective method at maintaining an environment that is condusive to helping others find the information they need?
[13:14:58] <emilyrose> conducive*
[13:15:29] <Woet> well, you're the first person to bring up this issue in the 3 years and 34 weeks the channel has existed, so yea, i think we're doing pretty well.
[13:15:43] <emilyrose> interesting!
[13:16:43] <emilyrose> I'm curious to know how long the ban will last
[13:16:57] <Woet> it'll be most likely be synced with my ban in #node.js
[13:17:06] <emilyrose> I'm sorry?
[13:17:35] <Woet> nothing to be sorry for
[13:17:43] <emilyrose> I'm not sure what #node.js has to do with #digitalocean
[13:17:45] <emilyrose> so I'm confused
[13:17:49] <emilyrose> how long will the ban last?
[13:17:52] <Woet> i'm not sure what ##javascript has to do with #node.js
[13:18:00] <emilyrose> ok...
[13:18:02] <Woet> besides the fact they are a similar syntax, of course
[13:18:06] <emilyrose> are you being cryptic on purpose?
[13:18:19] <Woet> no
[13:18:26] <emilyrose> I'm asking about the ban you placed against me in #digitalocean
[13:18:36] <emilyrose> nothing about #node.js or ##javascript
[13:18:36] <Woet> i'm aware
[13:18:45] <emilyrose> are you willing to give me that information?
[13:19:01] <Woet> we don't have specific ban lengths, we get rid of bans when the ban list is full
[13:19:21] <emilyrose> would I be correct in stating that it's basically "permanent" then?
[13:19:49] <Woet> absolutely not
[13:20:10] <emilyrose> then when might I reasonably expect the ban to be lifted?
[13:22:01] <Woet> about 30 seconds
[13:22:16] <Woet> and don't worry about the brand, most people know the definition of "unofficial"
[13:22:28] <emilyrose> what do you mean?
[13:22:41] <emilyrose> I don't recall saying anything about brand
[13:22:50] <Woet> that's okay
[13:23:10] <emilyrose> would you mind clarifying what you mean by "don't worry about the brand" ?
[13:23:53] <Woet> not unless i see a doctors note with a diagnosis of memory loss
[13:24:07] <emilyrose> I didn't say anything to you about "the brand"
[13:24:19] <emilyrose> so I'm asking you to help me understand why you said 'and don't worry about the brand, most people know the definition of "unofficial"'
[13:24:28] <Woet> unable to provide that i'm afraid
[13:24:46] <emilyrose> I see
[13:25:01] <emilyrose> do you make a regular habit of making statements you're not willing to reasonably explain?
[13:25:14] <emilyrose> or am I a special case?
[13:25:15] <Woet> depends whether the person I'm talking to is being intentionally dense or not
[13:25:33] <emilyrose> am I to understand that you're accusing me of being 'intentionally dense'?
[13:25:54] <Woet> no, that'd be offensive
[13:26:01] <emilyrose> so please help me understand, then...
[13:31:18] <Woet> take care
[13:31:20] <Woet> I'm done wasting my time with this conversation
[13:31:41] <emilyrose> I'm sorry you feel it has been a waste
[13:31:56] <emilyrose> thanks for what clarification you were willing to offer

## gistfile3.txt
[12:52:16] * Starting query with [joker]
[12:52:32] <emilyrose> I'm curious to know if refering to others as a "fucking retard" is acceptable in #digitalocean
[13:08:12] <emilyrose> I was just banned by Woet for asking for clarification on your policies
[13:08:27] <emilyrose> I'm a little frustrated by the hostility
[13:28:25] <emilyrose> https://gist.github.com/emilyrose/d9723ea71be3c78c56d0b21150dbb20a
[13:28:35] <emilyrose> I'll provide a transcript of my conversation with Woet once it's concluded
[13:28:45] <emilyrose> it's been... confusing, to say the least
[00:00:00] - {Day changed to July 21, 2016}
[05:45:36] <[joker]> hey sorry was asleep yesterday
[05:46:25] <[joker]> any other updates or feedback on the situation?  I also do see why you were banned, i dont know if it was exactly for "asking for clarification"
[05:57:58] <[joker]> the guys that called each other fucking retards are actually long time friends, and it was said completely in jest, im saddened that it was escalated to social justice level
[06:23:42] <[joker]> [12:58:11] <emilyrose> rascul: all I know is that it showed up in my buffer and it was pretty upsetting to see in #digitalocean
[06:23:59] <[joker]> even tho they tried to explain, it seems this did not concern you?
[06:33:24] <[joker]> [13:23:10] <emilyrose> would you mind clarifying what you mean by "don't worry about the brand" ?  <-- i would think it was obvious that he was reacting to your tweet, why act like you didnt know what he was referring to?
[06:36:38] <[joker]> just really saddened & confused as to what you were trying to achieve by arguing with them? :(
[09:40:51] <emilyrose> it's alarming to me that you find any of Woet's behaviour appropriate
[09:41:08] <emilyrose> he's someone I don't know who doesn't follow me on twitter who had no legitimate reason to go searching out my social media profiles
[09:41:24] <emilyrose> he then made creepy and vague mentions of the fact that he was creeping my profile
[09:41:52] <emilyrose> I'm just appauled with the way this was handled all around
[09:42:10] <emilyrose> and the fact that you would invoke the phrase 'social justice level' makes me seriously question your perception
[09:43:13] <[joker]> well, what was your intent to post on social media?
[09:43:44] <emilyrose> I wanted Digital Ocean to be aware of how poorly their brand was being represented by an unofficial "support" channel
[09:43:46] <[joker]> what was the whole point of it all, besides being upset that 'fucking retard' appeared on your stream?
[09:44:10] <emilyrose> my point is that by allowing that kind of behaviour, you're making the channel unwelcoming for all kinds of people who would other wise give and seek help
[09:44:14] <[joker]> but how is it a representation of their brand, when two people are chatting, and jokingly one calls the other a fucking retard?
[09:44:29] <[joker]> so your proposal is to ban the use of 'fucking retard' ?
[09:44:34] <emilyrose> absolutely
[09:44:35] <[joker]> police every word said in the channel?
[09:44:43] <emilyrose> that's quite a leap
[09:44:45] <emilyrose> lol
[09:44:49] <[joker]> you know that policing channels on irc is not effective, right ?
[09:44:55] <emilyrose> patently offensive phrases and "every word" are way different
[09:44:59] <emilyrose> actually, I know quite the opposite
[09:45:12] <[joker]> anything can be patently offensive, but again, this was a debate between two friends in the channel
[09:45:13] <emilyrose> engaged and compassionate moderation is very effective
[09:45:32] <emilyrose> Woet told me I wasn't welcome in the channel after I said 1 thing
[09:45:36] <emilyrose> literally that was his first response
[09:45:43] <emilyrose> he literally told me I was unwelcome and should leave
[09:45:47] <[joker]> there was no actual abuse of anyone, just a misunderstanding by you, from the logs -- several people tried to clear it up for you, but seemed you werent having it ?
[09:46:01] <[joker]> but i read the whole conversation
[09:46:02] <emilyrose> it's not acceptable to condone that kind of language in a community support channel, no.
[09:46:16] <emilyrose> regardless of the relationship of the individuals involved.
[09:46:32] <[joker]> he never said you werent welcome, he said you are welcome to leave if it offends you, which seemed reasonable
[09:46:38] <emilyrose> actually, he did
[09:46:41] <emilyrose> shall I paste it to you?
[09:46:55] <emilyrose> [12:51:46] <Woet> emilyrose: you're not welcome here
[09:47:04] <emilyrose> at that point
[09:47:06] <emilyrose> I had said 2 things
[09:47:10] <emilyrose> [12:49:32] <emilyrose> gparent: no need to be rude
[09:47:15] <emilyrose> [12:50:16] <emilyrose> gparent: it's still pretty unwelcoming to other people
[09:47:21] <emilyrose> that was Woet's very first response to me
[09:47:22] <emilyrose> as a moderator
[09:47:30] <emilyrose> not an attempt to deescalate
[09:47:35] <emilyrose> not an attempt to seek resolution
[09:47:43] <emilyrose> "you're not welcome here"
[09:47:47] <emilyrose> that's unacceptable
[09:47:53] <emilyrose> it also turns out
[09:48:01] <[joker]> that was already well after you established your stronghold
[09:48:03] <emilyrose> that his response was entirely motivated by some personal vendetta I had no clue of
[09:48:10] <emilyrose> what's a "stronghold" in this context?
[09:48:19] <emilyrose> the fact that I was taken aback by such disrespectful language?
[09:48:46] <emilyrose> [13:16:43] <emilyrose> I'm curious to know how long the ban will last
[09:48:46] <emilyrose> [13:16:57] <Woet> it'll be most likely be synced with my ban in #node.js
[09:48:59] <emilyrose> this person targeted me because of something that happened in #node.js
[09:49:04] <[joker]> whats the point of that line of questioning ?
[09:49:06] <emilyrose> something I had no memory of until I searched the logs
[09:49:26] <[joker]> the whole talk you had with woet is totally meaningless, you were clearly just wanting to argue with him
[09:49:31] <[joker]> which is fine
[09:49:35] <emilyrose> that's not clear
[09:49:38] <emilyrose> because it's not my desire
[09:49:43] <emilyrose> I have no desire to pointlessly argue with people
[09:49:47] <emilyrose> I was seeking resolution and understanding
[09:49:58] <emilyrose> which is why I messaged you in the first place
[09:50:39] <[joker]> well, can i ask you again, what was the point of posting on twitter?  what would you like to accomplish with it?  (im curious, what was your desired outcome)
[09:50:51] <[joker]> what would you like to see done about it
[09:51:19] <emilyrose> I'd like to see #digitalocean moderated responsibly
[09:51:59] <[joker]> is that all?
[09:52:07] <emilyrose> what do you mean?
[09:52:08] <[joker]> i mean, what was your hope posting on twitter? etc
[09:52:14] <[joker]> you were talking about brand protection
[09:52:17] <emilyrose> I'd like to see #digitalocean moderated responsibly
[09:52:25] <emilyrose> what's brand protection?
[09:52:28] <[joker]> why not mention that in your tweet, or allude to it?
[09:52:29] <emilyrose> I said "harmful to their brand"
[09:52:31] <emilyrose> I did
[09:52:36] <emilyrose> did you read my tweet?
[09:52:36] <[joker]> right, that would be the brand protection bit
[09:52:46] <emilyrose> who made you aware of my tweet?
[09:52:51] <emilyrose> I didn't mention it to anyone in #digitalocean
[09:53:05] <emilyrose> why is that part of this conversation?
[09:53:19] <[joker]> im asking what was your goal with the posting on twitter
[09:53:42] <[joker]> just trying to understand what you were hoping to achieve
[09:56:21] <[joker]> and yes, i did read your tweet, that seems kind of obvious?  ... just see you post that something you misunderstood and took out of context, and then pushed forward with it on twitter ... not really seeing any other tweets that allude to "want moderation of #Digitalocean"
[09:57:02] <[joker]> reading the log, people tried really hard to explain to you, that they are two friends, called each other fucking retard , which is quite normal
[09:57:24] <[joker]> and you said you didnt really care for the context, because it appeared on your buffer, and it upset you
[09:58:15] <emilyrose> are you willing to tell me how you became aware of my tweet?
[09:58:31] <emilyrose> if we're going to discuss what I posted on twitter
[09:58:39] <emilyrose> it's important to understand how/why you know about it
[09:58:47] <[joker]> i woke up and got several messages with it
[09:58:53] <emilyrose> from whom?
[09:59:15] <[joker]> someone inside DO
[09:59:24] <emilyrose> what was their name?
[10:00:08] <[joker]> i fail to see the importance of that?   i dont like to give out information which could be internal/private
[10:00:17] <[joker]> if you want to help me better understand your approach, do so
[10:00:29] <emilyrose> interesting ;)
[10:00:51] <emilyrose> so are you refusing to provide me with the name of the DO employee who was acting on official business?
[10:01:05] <emilyrose> did they request anonymity?
[10:01:05] <[joker]> what?
[10:01:18] <emilyrose> your claim is that someone from DO made you aware of a tweet I posted
[10:01:27] <emilyrose> and now you are refusing to give me their name
[10:01:54] <emilyrose> I can only assume that they reached out to you as an official representative of Digital Ocean, is that correct?
[10:02:15] <[joker]> i dont even know what is supposed to mean
[10:02:40] <[joker]> not sure why i am somehow required to divulge private internal company information to you, if you would like to make a point RE your tweet, please continue
[10:03:01] <[joker]> or otherwise help me better understand the relevance of the person who sent me a pmsg about it
[10:05:46] <emilyrose> the thing that is confusing and creepy to me is that you're willing to offhandedly mention that you're aware of the existence of my tweet
[10:05:57] <emilyrose> yet you claim that some anonymous digital employee provided you with a link to my tweet
[10:06:03] <emilyrose> that is alarming to me for several reasons
[10:06:22] <[joker]> enlighten me what relevance is the employee name in this scenario?
[10:06:28] <[joker]> you think im making it up ??
[10:06:48] <emilyrose> I'd like to follow up with them
[10:06:52] <emilyrose> are you making it up?
[10:07:16] <[joker]> i mean, what exactly do i have to gain?
[10:07:26] <emilyrose> understanding
[10:07:31] <emilyrose> so I will ask you again
[10:07:34] <[joker]> no, in lying about your tweet
[10:07:40] <emilyrose> ok
[10:07:43] <[joker]> what would i have to gain by making up that i read your tweet
[10:07:44] <emilyrose> then how did you become aware of my tweet?
[10:07:58] <[joker]> i will repeat again, it was passed on to me by a DO person
[10:08:04] <emilyrose> who was that DO person?
[10:08:12] <[joker]> im not giving you any names
[10:08:21] <emilyrose> thank you for your time
[10:08:46] <[joker]> well then
[10:08:54] [ChanServ] Information on #digitalocean:
[10:08:54] [ChanServ] Founder    : [Joker]
[10:08:54] [ChanServ] Registered : Nov 20 16:13:59 2012 (3y 34w 6d ago)
[10:08:54] [ChanServ] URL        : https://www.digitalocean.com/
[10:08:54] [ChanServ] Entrymsg   : Welcome to the unofficial DigitalOcean community IRC channel! | If you require immediate assistance, please open a ticket at https://cloud.digitalocean.com/support (login required). | Channel rules: http://irc.sammytheshark.com/rules
[10:08:54] [ChanServ] Flags      : SECURE KEEPTOPIC TOPICLOCK GUARD
[10:08:54] [ChanServ] *** End of Info ***
[10:14:32] <[joker]> do you mind if i ask you to /part #DigitalOcean for now?  I would like to avoid any further incidents
[10:14:59] <[joker]> as i do not have control over what people say in the channel, i am afraid it might trigger you in some way, which i want to avoid at this time
[10:15:38] <[joker]> im not quite ready to moderate it at this time, and just need some time to regroup and organize what i plan to do with the channel moving forward
[10:15:50] <[joker]> actually was about to just shut down the entire channel

## gistfile4.txt
[10:11:14] <Mew> Woet pls
[10:11:19] <lbft> pls
[10:11:24] -*- Woet puts Mew in a pokeball
[10:11:34] <Mew> that's oppressive
[10:11:43] -*- Woet throws the pokeball into the indian ocean
[10:11:47] <lbft> an actual mew would probably lead to a stampede
[10:11:51] <Woet> see if you can find MH370
[10:11:55] <lbft> of people with their phones
[10:12:07] <Woet> lbft probably shot it down
[10:13:16] <lbft> with what
[10:13:31] <Mew> a russian
[10:13:33] <Woet> a kfc chicken strip
[10:13:36] <gparent> a rly strong laser pointer
[10:14:29] <Woet> i legitimate think she has "retard" on highlight
[10:15:15] -*- Woet waits
[10:15:34] <Mew> pls
[10:15:45] <rascul> 'apt-get install facebook you fucking retard' triggered it before
[10:16:00] <Mew> does it work for myspace too
[10:16:05] <rascul> try it
[10:16:09] <-* [joker] has kicked rascul from #digitalocean (BANNED)
[10:17:23] <RandyTheRaccoon> [DigitalOcean Community Questions] VPN tunnel from DO to private network - https://www.digitalocean.com/community/questions/vpn-tunnel-from-do-to-private-network
[10:18:25] -*- rascul was bad :(
[10:18:36] <Mew> rascul needs a time out
[10:18:50] <lbft> what more could you expect from the sort of rebel that ircs as root
[10:18:53] -*- rascul sits in the corner
[10:18:56] <lbft> that's hardcore, man
[10:19:02] <rascul> i don't irc as root!
[10:19:03] <Ahrotahntee> rascul: say it ain't so. you really irc as root?
[10:19:12] <Ahrotahntee> that's just embarrassing
[10:19:38] <rascul> what makes you think i'm root?
[10:20:53] <Ahrotahntee> it's all over the net, nobody really knows where these rumors start
[10:21:29] <lbft> taylor swift tweeted about it
[10:21:32] <rascul> get off my net!
[10:21:43] <rascul> don't make me use the root!
[10:21:43] <Ahrotahntee> it might actually be the title of the new Billy Ray album
[10:22:23] <-* ChanServ has kicked emilyrose from #digitalocean (User is banned from this channel)
	[12:43:03] <Guest48> ok cool, and do you guys get mad if I need help setting up znc on vps ??
	[12:47:46] <Woet> Guest48: who is "you guys"?
	[12:47:57] <Guest48> people using this channel
	[12:48:10] <Woet> no, we do not get mad when people ask for help
	[12:48:12] <rascul> what about the gals? do you not care if they get mad?
	[12:48:26] <Woet> else daoenix wouldn't be here
	[12:48:30] <Woet> he asks us for help with all the tickets he does
	[12:48:41] <rascul> help me linux
	[12:48:47] <rascul> how do i install facebook on my droplet?
	[12:48:54] <gparent> apt-get install facebook you fucking retard
	[12:49:05] <Woet> wow
	[12:49:14] <gparent> do you need me to download ram for you too??
	[12:49:32] <emilyrose> gparent: no need to be rude
	[12:49:33] <rascul> E: Unable to locate package facebook
	[12:49:34] <rascul> E: Unable to locate package you
	[12:49:36] <rascul> E: Unable to locate package freaking
	[12:49:37] <rascul> E: Unable to locate package retar
	[12:49:52] <gparent> emilyrose: we're joking
	[12:49:54] <gparent> lol rascul
	[12:49:56] <Guest48> are free irc bouncer services secure?
	[12:50:01] <rascul> no
	[12:50:13] <rascul> znc is pretty easy though
	[12:50:14] <gparent> I wouldn't call any bouncer service secure but they aren't insecure either.
	[12:50:16] <emilyrose> gparent: it's still pretty unwelcoming to other people
	[12:50:30] <rascul> gparent quit unwelcoming me
	[12:50:50] -*- gparent sends mountains of chocolates and puppies to rascul with get well cards and happy birthday wishes
	[12:51:01] <rascul> chocolate puppies?
	[12:51:09] <Guest48> gparent : I'm wondering if to suscribe to DO or to get a free 5 network bnc from stormbnc....if I use ssl to connect to the bnc, the admins will still be able to read everything ?
	[12:51:09] <gparent> emilyrose: ill take a pass on this one
	[12:51:20] -*- Woet takes the chocolates
	[12:51:46] <Woet> emilyrose: you're not welcome here
	[12:51:46] <rascul> Guest48 only the connection to you and the server would be encrypted, the admins could potentially read what they wanted
	[12:51:52] <gparent> Guest48: the operators of the service have a privileged place
	[12:51:54] <Woet> emilyrose: if you are offended, please leave.
	[12:51:56] <rascul> you can znc on a droplet and do other things too, all for $5
	[12:52:04] <emilyrose> Woet: you are mistaken
	[12:52:13] <Guest48> rascul: i just dont know what else can I use the droplet for apart znc ? any ideas ?
	[12:52:21] <rascul> web server type stuff?
	[12:52:24] <rascul> owncloud?
	[12:52:28] <rascul> vpn?
	[12:52:35] <gparent> Guest48: buying a droplet instead of using another's bouncer service removes one layer of the stack from having delegated trust
	[12:52:40] <rascul> dns so your isp doesn't hijack yours?
	[12:52:49] <gparent> but it involves one more layer of work..
	[12:52:58] <Guest48> vpn to watch netflix us or Do is banned by netflix ?
	[12:53:07] <Woet> emilyrose: this channel doesn't revolve around tiptoeing around peoples feelings, if people are offended or feel unwelcome that is their problem
	[12:53:09] <rascul> well i guess you could do that
	[12:53:20] <Woet> emilyrose: especially when it's simply a matter of using words like "retard".
	[12:53:29] <rascul> vpn's are useful for all kinds of things, not just pretending you're somewhere you're not
	[12:53:46] <Guest48> I guess DO doesn't allow vp to download torrents :P
	[12:53:47] <emilyrose> Woet: interesting perspective
	[12:53:50] <Guest48> vp = vpn
	[12:53:54] <Woet> emilyrose: thank you
	[12:53:56] <rascul> what's wrong with torrents?
	[12:54:08] <Guest48> I mean, illegal torrents
	[12:54:14] <rascul> illegal torrents are illegal
	[12:54:15] <gparent> for what it`s worth my own opinion of it is that people who go out of their way to be offended by banter between friends aren`t high on my concerns list
	[12:54:17] <emilyrose> Woet: so the part of the topic that mentions not insulting people is just there for show, then?
	[12:54:33] <gparent> it's not.
	[12:54:35] -*- rascul crosses gparent off his concerns list
	[12:54:42] <gparent> we don't tolerate abusive behavior
	[12:54:43] <emilyrose> gparent: I have no clue what your relationship is to the person you're insulting
	[12:54:46] <Woet> emilyrose: direct insults that are not in banter? yea, that's not allowed
	[12:54:54] <emilyrose> "banter"
	[12:54:54] <emilyrose> haha
	[12:55:02] <rascul> bantha > banter
	[12:55:02] <Guest48> can we use a droplet like a ftp server ? for personnal stuff?
	[12:55:03] <Woet> emilyrose: it's not up to you to decide whether rascul is offended of not
	[12:55:08] <Woet> emilyrose: if he is then he'll say so
	[12:55:08] <rascul> Guest48 sure
	[12:55:14] <emilyrose> Woet: I haven't indicated that it was
	[12:55:16] <rascul> but ftp is horrible
	[12:55:16] <timekeeper> did somebody call rascul a buttface
	[12:55:21] <emilyrose> Woet: but I appreciate your concern
	[12:55:26] <Guest48> which plan do you recommend me ?
	[12:55:26] <rascul> timekeeper get your face out of my butt
	[12:55:34] <timekeeper> no
	[12:55:35] <rascul> Guest48 $5 unless you need/want more
	[12:55:45] <Guest48> that's in US dollars
	[12:55:49] <Guest48> ermm...$7
	[12:55:50] <Guest48> per month
	[12:55:51] <emilyrose> I'm actually the one that's offended in this case
	[12:55:58] <timekeeper> yeah, USD :/
	[12:56:03] <rascul> $5 in freedom dollars
	[12:56:03] <gparent> that wasn`t really the debate
	[12:56:13] <emilyrose> there was a debate?
	[12:56:16] <emilyrose> I must have missed it
	[12:56:19] <emilyrose> all I saw was "banter"
	[12:56:27] <gparent> trump came by
	[12:56:27] <gparent> you should`ve seen it
	[12:56:29] <gparent> real issues were discussed
	[12:56:31] <rascul> emilyrose what was offensive to you?
	[12:56:34] <Woet> emilyrose: https://i1.wp.com/theshake.com.au/wp-content/uploads/2013/07/offended.jpg - hope this helps
	[12:56:55] <emilyrose> rascul: the use of the phrase "Fucking retard" in a community support channel
	[12:57:09] <Guest48> why all your idendts are ~ and not your nick ? ex: gparent@... it's ~gparent
	[12:57:20] <gparent> I dont run identd
	[12:57:35] <rascul> i run identd
	[12:57:35] <gparent> when you don't, the ircd may prepend that do your user
	[12:57:39] <gparent> to*
	[12:57:41] <Guest48> I see, and what's the advantage of running identd ?
	[12:57:46] <gparent> none I can think of
	[12:57:47] <rascul> emilyrose even though it was said jokingly and not directed at you?
	[12:57:49] <gparent> except removing that ~
	[12:58:03] <Guest48> ok
	[12:58:05] <rascul> Guest48 that's literally the only use for identd in the context of irc
	[12:58:05] <timekeeper> what was said?
	[12:58:11] <emilyrose> rascul: all I know is that it showed up in my buffer and it was pretty upsetting to see in #digitalocean
	[12:58:28] <Guest48> I'm still thinking it's expensive just for a bnc bouncer lol
	[12:58:30] <Woet> emilyrose: then you should probably leave.
	[12:58:44] <emilyrose> Woet: that's the second time you've told me to leave
	[12:58:46] <gparent> I will sometimes be overly emotive in an attempt to humor, it doesn't happen that often that I use those words in public channels I don't think
	[12:59:00] <Guest48> it only has 20gb of space, not much clouding there
	[12:59:07] <emilyrose> gparent: do you think it's something that should be accepted?
	[12:59:10] <gparent> honestly, I'd concern myself more about people who are actually abusive to others in here and point them out
	[12:59:10] <Woet> emilyrose: yea, if you can't control your emotions and get offended by simple word usage not directed at you, it's not a good place to be
	[12:59:14] <Woet> emilyrose: please stop wasting our time.
	[12:59:17] <Woet> emilyrose: leave or deal with it.
	[12:59:27] <emilyrose> Woet: I've chosen to deal with it, which I'm doing now
	[12:59:35] <rascul> Guest48 only cool people like me run identd anyway
	[12:59:42] <Woet> emilyrose: okay, deal with it by yourself and not by not wasting our time.
	[12:59:45] <Guest48> haha
	[12:59:53] <emilyrose> Woet: you're welcome to disengage from the conversation if you feel it's a waste of your time
	[12:59:55] <Guest48> i wish I had my own server to get a free znc
	[12:59:59] <gparent> emilyrose: I think it should be up to the called and the callee, and I think if I was being abusive for real others should pitch in and tell me so
	[13:00:02] <Woet> emilyrose: final warning.
	[13:00:13] <emilyrose> Woet: warning about what exactly?
	[13:00:22] <gparent> about dropping this trivial issue
	[13:00:25] <emilyrose> it's not trivial though
	[13:00:26] <Woet> emilyrose: stop wasting our time, stop discussing this. drop it or leave.
	[13:00:32] <emilyrose> and I'm asking for clarification on the moderation policy of the channel
	[13:00:41] <emilyrose> if an op would rather PM me, that's fine too
	[13:00:46] <gparent> it wouldn't be trivial if I was being abusive, which I wasn't.
	[13:01:07] <emilyrose> so it's about intent?
	[13:01:15] <KDDLB> emilyrose – this is an unofficial channel
	[13:01:30] <emilyrose> KDDLB: that's pretty obvious :P
	[13:01:39] <gparent> it's about intent to the extent that I know for a fact that rascul won't suddenly forget that I like him and he knows that 'facebook' isn't a package tracked by Debian repos.
	[13:01:51] <gparent> so there's no possible way he could be offended
	[13:01:58] <gparent> as for the rules, that is
	[13:02:04] <emilyrose> gparent: so your assertion is that it doesn't matter if anyone else in the channel (501 other people) is offended
	[13:02:07] <gparent> for your thing about offending words that's a different issues
	[13:02:26] <gparent> that's not what I said
	[13:02:30] <rascul> i'm still confused how other people besides me could be in a position to take offense to that
	[13:02:30] <gparent> I'm explaining the rules
	[13:02:32] <emilyrose> gparent: I'm asking
	[13:02:36] <gparent> and I'm replying
	[13:02:46] <gparent> you made up a conclusion to my reply which isn't true so Im saying so
	[13:02:57] <emilyrose> gparent: thanks for clarifying
	[13:03:43] <gparent> so the rules are meant to protect direct abuse, as far as I understand, not the personal beliefs of 501 different people
	[13:03:51] <gparent> woet would split on actual problems
	[13:03:54] <gparent> im not an op
	[13:04:04] <rascul> wow i can't even count to 501
	[13:04:13] <gparent> it's one short to where you can count to though
	[13:04:14] <timekeeper> woet pls
	[13:04:22] <gparent> just count yourself and then 500
	[13:04:23] <rascul> so it's right after 6?
	[13:04:44] <rascul> maths is so hard :(
	[13:04:54] <timekeeper> its easier if you're azn
	[13:05:06] <rascul> what's azn? is that like amazon?
	[13:05:36] <emilyrose> gparent: so I guess I'm still confused
	[13:05:41] <timekeeper> :/
	[13:05:59] <emilyrose> gparent: I'm trying to understand how or more importantly why it's deemed acceptable to call someone a "fucking retard" in #digitalocean just because you know them
	[13:06:00] <Woet> emilyrose: i warned you several times, you can discuss it in pm if you disagree.
	[13:06:03] <-* Woet has kicked emilyrose from #digitalocean (Your behavior is not conducive to the desired environment.)
	[13:06:35] * Starting query with woet
	[13:07:00] <emilyrose> so am I to understand that you've banned me from #digitalocean for my concern over the use of offensive language?
	[13:08:41] <Woet> no, I banned you for continuing to discuss something after you were told three times to stop
	[13:08:52] <emilyrose> I see
	[13:09:22] <emilyrose> so you've banned me for asking for clarification on a policy that didn't appear to be enforced?
	[13:09:29] <emilyrose> even though I offered to take it to PM with an op?
	[13:09:37] <Woet> you're taking it up with an op right now
	[13:09:40] <Woet> i'll be happy to clarify
	[13:09:46] <emilyrose> but you banned me first
	[13:09:48] <emilyrose> why is that?
	[13:10:03] <Woet> fairly certain that's how you do things too
	[13:10:03] <emilyrose> I feel like my request to speak with an op directly was pretty clear
	[13:10:07] <Woet> not sure why you have an issue with it
	[13:10:20] <emilyrose> my issue is that someone was using abusive language
	[13:10:28] <emilyrose> and it was me (the one who was concerned by it) who was banned
	[13:10:43] <emilyrose> even though I remained completely calm and offered to discuss it in PM
	[13:10:48] <emilyrose> which you've only done AFTER banning me
	[13:10:53] <emilyrose> why was that necessary?
	[13:12:59] <Woet> it was necessary because you continued to discuss something after you were told to stop it
	[13:13:19] <Woet> you were specifically told that if you were offended or concerned by it, to either deal with it by yourself or to leave
	[13:13:32] <Woet> you choose neither of those options
	[13:13:54] <emilyrose> is that your response to everyone who expresses concern at hostile behaviour?
	[13:13:58] <emilyrose> "deal with it or leave"
	[13:14:06] <Woet> if it's not directed at that person, absolutely
	[13:14:09] <emilyrose> interesting
	[13:14:43] <emilyrose> Do you feel like this is an effective method at maintaining an environment that is condusive to helping others find the information they need?
	[13:14:58] <emilyrose> conducive*
	[13:15:29] <Woet> well, you're the first person to bring up this issue in the 3 years and 34 weeks the channel has existed, so yea, i think we're doing pretty well.
	[13:15:43] <emilyrose> interesting!
	[13:16:43] <emilyrose> I'm curious to know how long the ban will last
	[13:16:57] <Woet> it'll be most likely be synced with my ban in #node.js
	[13:17:06] <emilyrose> I'm sorry?
	[13:17:35] <Woet> nothing to be sorry for
	[13:17:43] <emilyrose> I'm not sure what #node.js has to do with #digitalocean
	[13:17:45] <emilyrose> so I'm confused
	[13:17:49] <emilyrose> how long will the ban last?
	[13:17:52] <Woet> i'm not sure what ##javascript has to do with #node.js
	[13:18:00] <emilyrose> ok...
	[13:18:02] <Woet> besides the fact they are a similar syntax, of course
	[13:18:06] <emilyrose> are you being cryptic on purpose?
	[13:18:19] <Woet> no
	[13:18:26] <emilyrose> I'm asking about the ban you placed against me in #digitalocean
	[13:18:36] <emilyrose> nothing about #node.js or ##javascript
	[13:18:36] <Woet> i'm aware
	[13:18:45] <emilyrose> are you willing to give me that information?
	[13:19:01] <Woet> we don't have specific ban lengths, we get rid of bans when the ban list is full
	[13:19:21] <emilyrose> would I be correct in stating that it's basically "permanent" then?
	[13:19:49] <Woet> absolutely not
	[13:20:10] <emilyrose> then when might I reasonably expect the ban to be lifted?
	[13:22:01] <Woet> about 30 seconds
	[13:22:16] <Woet> and don't worry about the brand, most people know the definition of "unofficial"
	[13:22:28] <emilyrose> what do you mean?
	[13:22:41] <emilyrose> I don't recall saying anything about brand
	[13:22:50] <Woet> that's okay
	[13:23:10] <emilyrose> would you mind clarifying what you mean by "don't worry about the brand" ?
	[13:23:53] <Woet> not unless i see a doctors note with a diagnosis of memory loss
	[13:24:07] <emilyrose> I didn't say anything to you about "the brand"
	[13:24:19] <emilyrose> so I'm asking you to help me understand why you said 'and don't worry about the brand, most people know the definition of "unofficial"'
	[13:24:28] <Woet> unable to provide that i'm afraid
	[13:24:46] <emilyrose> I see
	[13:25:01] <emilyrose> do you make a regular habit of making statements you're not willing to reasonably explain?
	[13:25:14] <emilyrose> or am I a special case?
	[13:25:15] <Woet> depends whether the person I'm talking to is being intentionally dense or not
	[13:25:33] <emilyrose> am I to understand that you're accusing me of being 'intentionally dense'?
	[13:25:54] <Woet> no, that'd be offensive
	[13:26:01] <emilyrose> so please help me understand, then...
	[13:31:18] <Woet> take care
	[13:31:20] <Woet> I'm done wasting my time with this conversation
	[13:31:41] <emilyrose> I'm sorry you feel it has been a waste
	[13:31:56] <emilyrose> thanks for what clarification you were willing to offer
	[12:52:16] * Starting query with [joker]
	[12:52:32] <emilyrose> I'm curious to know if refering to others as a "fucking retard" is acceptable in #digitalocean
	[13:08:12] <emilyrose> I was just banned by Woet for asking for clarification on your policies
	[13:08:27] <emilyrose> I'm a little frustrated by the hostility
	[13:28:25] <emilyrose> https://gist.github.com/emilyrose/d9723ea71be3c78c56d0b21150dbb20a
	[13:28:35] <emilyrose> I'll provide a transcript of my conversation with Woet once it's concluded
	[13:28:45] <emilyrose> it's been... confusing, to say the least
	[00:00:00] - {Day changed to July 21, 2016}
	[05:45:36] <[joker]> hey sorry was asleep yesterday
	[05:46:25] <[joker]> any other updates or feedback on the situation? I also do see why you were banned, i dont know if it was exactly for "asking for clarification"
	[05:57:58] <[joker]> the guys that called each other fucking retards are actually long time friends, and it was said completely in jest, im saddened that it was escalated to social justice level
	[06:23:42] <[joker]> [12:58:11] <emilyrose> rascul: all I know is that it showed up in my buffer and it was pretty upsetting to see in #digitalocean
	[06:23:59] <[joker]> even tho they tried to explain, it seems this did not concern you?
	[06:33:24] <[joker]> [13:23:10] <emilyrose> would you mind clarifying what you mean by "don't worry about the brand" ? <-- i would think it was obvious that he was reacting to your tweet, why act like you didnt know what he was referring to?
	[06:36:38] <[joker]> just really saddened & confused as to what you were trying to achieve by arguing with them? :(
	[09:40:51] <emilyrose> it's alarming to me that you find any of Woet's behaviour appropriate
	[09:41:08] <emilyrose> he's someone I don't know who doesn't follow me on twitter who had no legitimate reason to go searching out my social media profiles
	[09:41:24] <emilyrose> he then made creepy and vague mentions of the fact that he was creeping my profile
	[09:41:52] <emilyrose> I'm just appauled with the way this was handled all around
	[09:42:10] <emilyrose> and the fact that you would invoke the phrase 'social justice level' makes me seriously question your perception
	[09:43:13] <[joker]> well, what was your intent to post on social media?
	[09:43:44] <emilyrose> I wanted Digital Ocean to be aware of how poorly their brand was being represented by an unofficial "support" channel
	[09:43:46] <[joker]> what was the whole point of it all, besides being upset that 'fucking retard' appeared on your stream?
	[09:44:10] <emilyrose> my point is that by allowing that kind of behaviour, you're making the channel unwelcoming for all kinds of people who would other wise give and seek help
	[09:44:14] <[joker]> but how is it a representation of their brand, when two people are chatting, and jokingly one calls the other a fucking retard?
	[09:44:29] <[joker]> so your proposal is to ban the use of 'fucking retard' ?
	[09:44:34] <emilyrose> absolutely
	[09:44:35] <[joker]> police every word said in the channel?
	[09:44:43] <emilyrose> that's quite a leap
	[09:44:45] <emilyrose> lol
	[09:44:49] <[joker]> you know that policing channels on irc is not effective, right ?
	[09:44:55] <emilyrose> patently offensive phrases and "every word" are way different
	[09:44:59] <emilyrose> actually, I know quite the opposite
	[09:45:12] <[joker]> anything can be patently offensive, but again, this was a debate between two friends in the channel
	[09:45:13] <emilyrose> engaged and compassionate moderation is very effective
	[09:45:32] <emilyrose> Woet told me I wasn't welcome in the channel after I said 1 thing
	[09:45:36] <emilyrose> literally that was his first response
	[09:45:43] <emilyrose> he literally told me I was unwelcome and should leave
	[09:45:47] <[joker]> there was no actual abuse of anyone, just a misunderstanding by you, from the logs -- several people tried to clear it up for you, but seemed you werent having it ?
	[09:46:01] <[joker]> but i read the whole conversation
	[09:46:02] <emilyrose> it's not acceptable to condone that kind of language in a community support channel, no.
	[09:46:16] <emilyrose> regardless of the relationship of the individuals involved.
	[09:46:32] <[joker]> he never said you werent welcome, he said you are welcome to leave if it offends you, which seemed reasonable
	[09:46:38] <emilyrose> actually, he did
	[09:46:41] <emilyrose> shall I paste it to you?
	[09:46:55] <emilyrose> [12:51:46] <Woet> emilyrose: you're not welcome here
	[09:47:04] <emilyrose> at that point
	[09:47:06] <emilyrose> I had said 2 things
	[09:47:10] <emilyrose> [12:49:32] <emilyrose> gparent: no need to be rude
	[09:47:15] <emilyrose> [12:50:16] <emilyrose> gparent: it's still pretty unwelcoming to other people
	[09:47:21] <emilyrose> that was Woet's very first response to me
	[09:47:22] <emilyrose> as a moderator
	[09:47:30] <emilyrose> not an attempt to deescalate
	[09:47:35] <emilyrose> not an attempt to seek resolution
	[09:47:43] <emilyrose> "you're not welcome here"
	[09:47:47] <emilyrose> that's unacceptable
	[09:47:53] <emilyrose> it also turns out
	[09:48:01] <[joker]> that was already well after you established your stronghold
	[09:48:03] <emilyrose> that his response was entirely motivated by some personal vendetta I had no clue of
	[09:48:10] <emilyrose> what's a "stronghold" in this context?
	[09:48:19] <emilyrose> the fact that I was taken aback by such disrespectful language?
	[09:48:46] <emilyrose> [13:16:43] <emilyrose> I'm curious to know how long the ban will last
	[09:48:46] <emilyrose> [13:16:57] <Woet> it'll be most likely be synced with my ban in #node.js
	[09:48:59] <emilyrose> this person targeted me because of something that happened in #node.js
	[09:49:04] <[joker]> whats the point of that line of questioning ?
	[09:49:06] <emilyrose> something I had no memory of until I searched the logs
	[09:49:26] <[joker]> the whole talk you had with woet is totally meaningless, you were clearly just wanting to argue with him
	[09:49:31] <[joker]> which is fine
	[09:49:35] <emilyrose> that's not clear
	[09:49:38] <emilyrose> because it's not my desire
	[09:49:43] <emilyrose> I have no desire to pointlessly argue with people
	[09:49:47] <emilyrose> I was seeking resolution and understanding
	[09:49:58] <emilyrose> which is why I messaged you in the first place
	[09:50:39] <[joker]> well, can i ask you again, what was the point of posting on twitter? what would you like to accomplish with it? (im curious, what was your desired outcome)
	[09:50:51] <[joker]> what would you like to see done about it
	[09:51:19] <emilyrose> I'd like to see #digitalocean moderated responsibly
	[09:51:59] <[joker]> is that all?
	[09:52:07] <emilyrose> what do you mean?
	[09:52:08] <[joker]> i mean, what was your hope posting on twitter? etc
	[09:52:14] <[joker]> you were talking about brand protection
	[09:52:17] <emilyrose> I'd like to see #digitalocean moderated responsibly
	[09:52:25] <emilyrose> what's brand protection?
	[09:52:28] <[joker]> why not mention that in your tweet, or allude to it?
	[09:52:29] <emilyrose> I said "harmful to their brand"
	[09:52:31] <emilyrose> I did
	[09:52:36] <emilyrose> did you read my tweet?
	[09:52:36] <[joker]> right, that would be the brand protection bit
	[09:52:46] <emilyrose> who made you aware of my tweet?
	[09:52:51] <emilyrose> I didn't mention it to anyone in #digitalocean
	[09:53:05] <emilyrose> why is that part of this conversation?
	[09:53:19] <[joker]> im asking what was your goal with the posting on twitter
	[09:53:42] <[joker]> just trying to understand what you were hoping to achieve
	[09:56:21] <[joker]> and yes, i did read your tweet, that seems kind of obvious? ... just see you post that something you misunderstood and took out of context, and then pushed forward with it on twitter ... not really seeing any other tweets that allude to "want moderation of #Digitalocean"
	[09:57:02] <[joker]> reading the log, people tried really hard to explain to you, that they are two friends, called each other fucking retard , which is quite normal
	[09:57:24] <[joker]> and you said you didnt really care for the context, because it appeared on your buffer, and it upset you
	[09:58:15] <emilyrose> are you willing to tell me how you became aware of my tweet?
	[09:58:31] <emilyrose> if we're going to discuss what I posted on twitter
	[09:58:39] <emilyrose> it's important to understand how/why you know about it
	[09:58:47] <[joker]> i woke up and got several messages with it
	[09:58:53] <emilyrose> from whom?
	[09:59:15] <[joker]> someone inside DO
	[09:59:24] <emilyrose> what was their name?
	[10:00:08] <[joker]> i fail to see the importance of that? i dont like to give out information which could be internal/private
	[10:00:17] <[joker]> if you want to help me better understand your approach, do so
	[10:00:29] <emilyrose> interesting ;)
	[10:00:51] <emilyrose> so are you refusing to provide me with the name of the DO employee who was acting on official business?
	[10:01:05] <emilyrose> did they request anonymity?
	[10:01:05] <[joker]> what?
	[10:01:18] <emilyrose> your claim is that someone from DO made you aware of a tweet I posted
	[10:01:27] <emilyrose> and now you are refusing to give me their name
	[10:01:54] <emilyrose> I can only assume that they reached out to you as an official representative of Digital Ocean, is that correct?
	[10:02:15] <[joker]> i dont even know what is supposed to mean
	[10:02:40] <[joker]> not sure why i am somehow required to divulge private internal company information to you, if you would like to make a point RE your tweet, please continue
	[10:03:01] <[joker]> or otherwise help me better understand the relevance of the person who sent me a pmsg about it
	[10:05:46] <emilyrose> the thing that is confusing and creepy to me is that you're willing to offhandedly mention that you're aware of the existence of my tweet
	[10:05:57] <emilyrose> yet you claim that some anonymous digital employee provided you with a link to my tweet
	[10:06:03] <emilyrose> that is alarming to me for several reasons
	[10:06:22] <[joker]> enlighten me what relevance is the employee name in this scenario?
	[10:06:28] <[joker]> you think im making it up ??
	[10:06:48] <emilyrose> I'd like to follow up with them
	[10:06:52] <emilyrose> are you making it up?
	[10:07:16] <[joker]> i mean, what exactly do i have to gain?
	[10:07:26] <emilyrose> understanding
	[10:07:31] <emilyrose> so I will ask you again
	[10:07:34] <[joker]> no, in lying about your tweet
	[10:07:40] <emilyrose> ok
	[10:07:43] <[joker]> what would i have to gain by making up that i read your tweet
	[10:07:44] <emilyrose> then how did you become aware of my tweet?
	[10:07:58] <[joker]> i will repeat again, it was passed on to me by a DO person
	[10:08:04] <emilyrose> who was that DO person?
	[10:08:12] <[joker]> im not giving you any names
	[10:08:21] <emilyrose> thank you for your time
	[10:08:46] <[joker]> well then
	[10:08:54] [ChanServ] Information on #digitalocean:
	[10:08:54] [ChanServ] Founder : [Joker]
	[10:08:54] [ChanServ] Registered : Nov 20 16:13:59 2012 (3y 34w 6d ago)
	[10:08:54] [ChanServ] URL : https://www.digitalocean.com/
	[10:08:54] [ChanServ] Entrymsg : Welcome to the unofficial DigitalOcean community IRC channel! \| If you require immediate assistance, please open a ticket at https://cloud.digitalocean.com/support (login required). \| Channel rules: http://irc.sammytheshark.com/rules
	[10:08:54] [ChanServ] Flags : SECURE KEEPTOPIC TOPICLOCK GUARD
	[10:08:54] [ChanServ] * End of Info *
	[10:14:32] <[joker]> do you mind if i ask you to /part #DigitalOcean for now? I would like to avoid any further incidents
	[10:14:59] <[joker]> as i do not have control over what people say in the channel, i am afraid it might trigger you in some way, which i want to avoid at this time
	[10:15:38] <[joker]> im not quite ready to moderate it at this time, and just need some time to regroup and organize what i plan to do with the channel moving forward
	[10:15:50] <[joker]> actually was about to just shut down the entire channel
	[10:11:14] <Mew> Woet pls
	[10:11:19] <lbft> pls
	[10:11:24] -*- Woet puts Mew in a pokeball
	[10:11:34] <Mew> that's oppressive
	[10:11:43] -*- Woet throws the pokeball into the indian ocean
	[10:11:47] <lbft> an actual mew would probably lead to a stampede
	[10:11:51] <Woet> see if you can find MH370
	[10:11:55] <lbft> of people with their phones
	[10:12:07] <Woet> lbft probably shot it down
	[10:13:16] <lbft> with what
	[10:13:31] <Mew> a russian
	[10:13:33] <Woet> a kfc chicken strip
	[10:13:36] <gparent> a rly strong laser pointer
	[10:14:29] <Woet> i legitimate think she has "retard" on highlight
	[10:15:15] -*- Woet waits
	[10:15:34] <Mew> pls
	[10:15:45] <rascul> 'apt-get install facebook you fucking retard' triggered it before
	[10:16:00] <Mew> does it work for myspace too
	[10:16:05] <rascul> try it
	[10:16:09] <-* [joker] has kicked rascul from #digitalocean (BANNED)
	[10:17:23] <RandyTheRaccoon> [DigitalOcean Community Questions] VPN tunnel from DO to private network - https://www.digitalocean.com/community/questions/vpn-tunnel-from-do-to-private-network
	[10:18:25] -*- rascul was bad :(
	[10:18:36] <Mew> rascul needs a time out
	[10:18:50] <lbft> what more could you expect from the sort of rebel that ircs as root
	[10:18:53] -*- rascul sits in the corner
	[10:18:56] <lbft> that's hardcore, man
	[10:19:02] <rascul> i don't irc as root!
	[10:19:03] <Ahrotahntee> rascul: say it ain't so. you really irc as root?
	[10:19:12] <Ahrotahntee> that's just embarrassing
	[10:19:38] <rascul> what makes you think i'm root?
	[10:20:53] <Ahrotahntee> it's all over the net, nobody really knows where these rumors start
	[10:21:29] <lbft> taylor swift tweeted about it
	[10:21:32] <rascul> get off my net!
	[10:21:43] <rascul> don't make me use the root!
	[10:21:43] <Ahrotahntee> it might actually be the title of the new Billy Ray album
	[10:22:23] <-* ChanServ has kicked emilyrose from #digitalocean (User is banned from this channel)