first_debate_2016.R

library(tidyverse)
library(stringr)

# read in the transcript
# I simply copied the text from the page at
# https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/the-fix/wp/2016/09/26/the-first-trump-clinton-presidential-debate-transcript-annotated/
# and popped it into a txt file
xx <- scan("first_debate_2016.txt", "character")

# split by speaker 
ind <- grep("TRUMP:|CLINTON:|HOLT:", xx)
by_speaker <- vector("list", length(ind))
for(i in seq_along(ind)){
  j <- ifelse(i == 0, 0, ifelse(i == length(ind), i-1, i+1))
  by_speaker[[i]] <- xx[ind[i]:(ind[j] - 1)]
}

# make speaker's name the list element name
names(by_speaker) <- 
  map(by_speaker, `[[`, 1) %>% 
  gsub(":", "", .)

# remove speakers name from spoken text
by_speaker <- 
  map(by_speaker, ~gsub("TRUMP:|CLINTON:|HOLT:", "", .)) %>% 
  map(., ~.x[.x != ""])

# remove Holt's turns
candidates_words <- by_speaker[!names(by_speaker) == "HOLT"]

# who had the most turns to speak?
table(names(candidates_words))

# who said the most words?
# words per turn?

candidates_words_df <- 
  candidates_words %>% 
  map(., ~length(.)) %>% 
  stack()
  
most_words <- 
  candidates_words_df %>% 
  group_by(ind) %>% 
  summarize(total_words_spoken_in_event = sum(values), 
            number_of_turns_to_speak = n()) %>% 
  gather(word_stat, value, -ind)

# plots
library(ggbeeswarm)
words_per_turn_plot <- 
  ggplot(candidates_words_df, 
         aes(ind, 
             values,
             colour = ind)) +
  geom_quasirandom(alpha = 0.5) +
  geom_point(aes(ind,
                 mean(values)),
             size = 5) +
  scale_y_log10() +
  ylab("Words per turn speaking") +
  xlab("") +
  scale_colour_discrete(name = "") +
  theme_bw()

most_words_plot <- 
ggplot(most_words,
       aes(ind, 
           value,
           colour = ind)) +
  geom_point(size = 5) +
  facet_wrap(~word_stat, scales = "free_y") +
  xlab("") +
  scale_colour_discrete(name = "") +
  theme_bw()

library(gridExtra)
grid.arrange(words_per_turn_plot, 
             most_words_plot,
             ncol = 1,
             top = "Summary of the word and turn counts in the debate")
 

# all of each candidate's words in one vector
hrc <- unname(unlist(candidates_words[names(candidates_words) == "CLINTON"]))
dt <- unname(unlist(candidates_words[names(candidates_words) == "TRUMP"]))
both <- c(hrc, dt)

# word counts
hrc_wc <- 
as_data_frame(table(hrc)) %>% arrange(desc(n)) %>% rename(word = hrc)

dt_wc <- 
  as_data_frame(table(dt)) %>% arrange(desc(n)) %>% rename(word = dt)

both_wc <- 
  as_data_frame(table(both)) %>% arrange(desc(n)) %>% rename(word = both)

# combine both speakers, convert words to lower case and remove duplicate words and spaces
all_words <- 
left_join(both_wc, hrc_wc, by = 'word') %>% 
  left_join(., dt_wc, by = 'word') %>% 
  rename(both = n.x, hrc = n.y, dt = n) %>% 
  mutate(word = gsub(" ", "", tolower(word))) %>% 
  group_by(word) %>% 
  slice(1)

# trumpiness and hilaryness, only for words they use at least five times

word_uniqueness <- 
all_words %>% 
  filter(hrc > 5,
         dt > 5) %>% 
  mutate(trumpiness = log(dt/both),
         hilaryness = log(hrc/both))

# most Trumpy words
trumpy <- 
word_uniqueness %>% 
  arrange(desc(trumpiness))

# most Hilaryness words
hilary <- 
word_uniqueness %>% 
  arrange(desc(hilaryness))

# plot most extreme words
n <- 20
extreme_words <- 
rbind(trumpy[1:n, ],
      hilary[1:n, ])
extreme_words$speaker <- c(rep("dt", n), rep("hrc", n))

library(ggrepel)
ggplot(extreme_words,
       aes(trumpiness, 
           hilaryness)) +
  geom_text_repel(aes(label = word,
                      colour = speaker),
                  segment.color = NA) +
  guides(colour = 'none') +
  theme_bw() +
  ggtitle("Words that are most distinctive of the speaker")

# most common from DT v HRC
# method from David Robinson's excellent post on Trump's tweets, at http://varianceexplained.org/r/trump-tweets/
logratios <- 
all_words %>% 
  filter(hrc > 5,
         dt > 5) %>% 
  map_if(is.integer, as.double) %>%
  as_data_frame() %>% 
  mutate_each(funs((. + 1) / sum(. + 1)), -word) %>%
  mutate(logratio = log2(hrc / dt)) %>%
  arrange(desc(logratio))

# plot them
logratios %>% 
  filter(logratio > 1 |
         logratio < -1) %>% 
ggplot(., aes(reorder(word, logratio),
           logratio)) +
  geom_bar(stat = "identity") +
  coord_flip()
# same as 'extreme words plot'

# sentiment analysis, also from David Robinson's wonderful work
# and using the tidytext package from Julia Silge
library(tidytext)
nrc <- sentiments %>%
  filter(lexicon == "nrc") %>%
  dplyr::select(word, sentiment)

sentiment_counts <- 
all_words %>% 
  gather(speaker,  n, -word) %>% 
  group_by(speaker) %>% 
  mutate(total_words = sum(n, na.rm = TRUE)) %>% 
  left_join(nrc) %>% 
  filter(speaker != 'both') %>% 
  group_by(sentiment, speaker, total_words) %>% 
  summarise(sentiment_words = sum(n, na.rm = TRUE))

library(broom) 

sentiment_differences <- 
  sentiment_counts %>%
  group_by(sentiment) %>%
  do(tidy(poisson.test(.$sentiment_words, .$total_words))) %>% 
  filter(!is.na(sentiment))

library(scales)

sentiment_differences %>%
  ungroup() %>%
  mutate(sentiment = reorder(sentiment, estimate)) %>%
  mutate_each(funs(. - 1), estimate, conf.low, conf.high) %>%
  ggplot(aes(estimate, sentiment)) +
  geom_point(aes(colour = estimate < 0)) +
  geom_errorbarh(aes(xmin = conf.low, 
                     xmax = conf.high,
                     colour = estimate < 0)) +
  scale_x_continuous(labels = percent_format()) +
  guides(colour = "none") +
  labs(x = "% increase in DT relative to HRC",
       y = "Sentiment") +
  theme_bw() +
  ggtitle("Differences in sentiments implied \nby the words of each speaker")

  
  









  

first_debate_2016.txt

           LESTER HOLT: Good evening from Hofstra University in Hempstead New York Im Lester Holt anchor of NBC Nightly News I want to welcome you to the first presidential debate
           
           The participants tonight are Donald Trump and Hillary Clinton This debate is sponsored by the Commission on Presidential Debates a nonpartisan nonprofit organization The commission drafted tonights format and the rules have been agreed to by the campaigns
           
           The 90-minute debate is divided into six segments each 15 minutes long Well explore three topic areas tonight: Achieving prosperity; Americas direction; and securing America At the start of each segment I will ask the same lead-off question to both candidates and they will each have up to two minutes to respond From that point until the end of the segment well have an open discussion
           
           The questions are mine and have not been shared with the commission or the campaigns The audience here in the room has agreed to remain silent so that we can focus on what the candidates are saying
           
           I will invite you to applaud however at this moment as we welcome the candidates: Democratic nominee for president of the United States Hillary Clinton and Republican nominee for president of the United States Donald J Trump
           
           (APPLAUSE)
           
           CLINTON: How are you Donald?")
           
           
           HOLT: Good luck to you
           
           (APPLAUSE)
           
           Well I dont expect us to cover all the issues of this campaign tonight but I remind everyone there are two more presidential debates scheduled We are going to focus on many of the issues that voters tell us are most important and were going to press for specifics I am honored to have this role but this evening belongs to the candidates and just as important to the American people
           
           Candidates we look forward to hearing you articulate your policies and your positions as well as your visions and your values So lets begin
           
           Were calling this opening segment Achieving Prosperity And central to that is jobs There are two economic realities in America today Theres been a record six straight years of job growth and new census numbers show incomes have increased at a record rate after years of stagnation However income inequality remains significant and nearly half of Americans are living paycheck to paycheck
           
           Beginning with you Secretary Clinton why are you a better choice than your opponent to create the kinds of jobs that will put more money into the pockets of American works?
           
           CLINTON: Well thank you Lester and thanks to Hofstra for hosting us
           
           The central question in this election is really what kind of country we want to be and what kind of future well build together Today is my granddaughters second birthday so I think about this a lot First we have to build an economy that works for everyone not just those at the top That means we need new jobs good jobs with rising incomes
           
           I want us to invest in you I want us to invest in your future That means jobs in infrastructure in advanced manufacturing innovation and technology clean renewable energy and small business because most of the new jobs will come from small business We also have to make the economy fairer That starts with raising the national minimum wage and also guarantee finally equal pay for womens work
           
           CLINTON: I also want to see more companies do profit-sharing If you help create the profits you should be able to share in them not just the executives at the top
           
           And I want us to do more to support people who are struggling to balance family and work Ive heard from so many of you about the difficult choices you face and the stresses that youre under So lets have paid family leave earned sick days Lets be sure we have affordable child care and debt-free college
           
           How are we going to do it? Were going to do it by having the wealthy pay their fair share and close the corporate loopholes
           
           Finally we tonight are on the stage together Donald Trump and I Donald its good to be with you Were going to have a debate where we are talking about the important issues facing our country You have to judge us who can shoulder the immense awesome responsibilities of the presidency who can put into action the plans that will make your life better I hope that I will be able to earn your vote on November 8th
           
           HOLT: Secretary Clinton thank you
           
           Mr Trump the same question to you Its about putting money -- more money into the pockets of American workers You have up to two minutes
           
           TRUMP: Thank you Lester Our jobs are fleeing the country Theyre going to Mexico Theyre going to many other countries You look at what China is doing to our country in terms of making our product Theyre devaluing their currency and theres nobody in our government to fight them And we have a very good fight And we have a winning fight Because theyre using our country as a piggy bank to rebuild China and many other countries are doing the same thing
           
           So were losing our good jobs so many of them When you look at whats happening in Mexico a friend of mine who builds plants said its the eighth wonder of the world Theyre building some of the biggest plants anywhere in the world some of the most sophisticated some of the best plants With the United States as he said not so much
           
           So Ford is leaving You see that their small car division leaving Thousands of jobs leaving Michigan leaving Ohio Theyre all leaving And we cant allow it to happen anymore As far as child care is concerned and so many other things I think Hillary and I agree on that We probably disagree a little bit as to numbers and amounts and what were going to do but perhaps well be talking about that later
           
           But we have to stop our jobs from being stolen from us We have to stop our companies from leaving the United States and with it firing all of their people All you have to do is take a look at Carrier air conditioning in Indianapolis They left -- fired 1400 people Theyre going to Mexico So many hundreds and hundreds of companies are doing this
           
           TRUMP: We cannot let it happen Under my plan Ill be reducing taxes tremendously from 35 percent to 15 percent for companies small and big businesses Thats going to be a job creator like we havent seen since Ronald Reagan Its going to be a beautiful thing to watch
           
           CONTENT FROM EPIX
           Think youd like to live in the White House?
           A sneak peek into First Family dynamics—and dysfunction
           Companies will come They will build They will expand New companies will start And I look very very much forward to doing it We have to renegotiate our trade deals and we have to stop these countries from stealing our companies and our jobs
           
           HOLT: Secretary Clinton would you like to respond?
           
           CLINTON: Well I think that trade is an important issue Of course we are 5 percent of the worlds population; we have to trade with the other 95 percent And we need to have smart fair trade deals
           
           We also though need to have a tax system that rewards work and not just financial transactions And the kind of plan that Donald has put forth would be trickle-down economics all over again In fact it would be the most extreme version the biggest tax cuts for the top percent of the people in this country than weve ever had
           
           I call it trumped-up trickle-down because thats exactly what it would be That is not how we grow the economy
           
           We just have a different view about whats best for growing the economy how we make investments that will actually produce jobs and rising incomes
           
           I think we come at it from somewhat different perspectives I understand that You know Donald was very fortunate in his life and thats all to his benefit He started his business with 14 million borrowed from his father and he really believes that the more you help wealthy people the better off well be and that everything will work out from there
           
           I dont buy that I have a different experience My father was a small-businessman He worked really hard He printed drapery fabrics on long tables where he pulled out those fabrics and he went down with a silkscreen and dumped the paint in and took the squeegee and kept going
           
           And so what I believe is the more we can do for the middle class the more we can invest in you your education your skills your future the better we will be off and the better well grow Thats the kind of economy I want us to see again
           
           HOLT: Let me follow up with Mr Trump if you can Youve talked about creating 25 million jobs and youve promised to bring back millions of jobs for Americans How are you going to bring back the industries that have left this country for cheaper labor overseas? How specifically are you going to tell American manufacturers that you have to come back?
           
           CONTENT FROM EPIX
           The dark side of First Families
           Living in the White House isnt as glamorous as it seems
           TRUMP: Well for one thing -- and before we start on that -- my father gave me a very small loan in 1975 and I built it into a company thats worth many many billions of dollars with some of the greatest assets in the world and I say that only because thats the kind of thinking that our country needs
           
           Our countrys in deep trouble We dont know what were doing when it comes to devaluations and all of these countries all over the world especially China Theyre the best the best ever at it What theyre doing to us is a very very sad thing
           
           So we have to do that We have to renegotiate our trade deals And Lester theyre taking our jobs theyre giving incentives theyre doing things that frankly we dont do
           
           Let me give you the example of Mexico They have a VAT tax Were on a different system When we sell into Mexico theres a tax When they sell in -- automatic 16 percent approximately When they sell into us theres no tax Its a defective agreement Its been defective for a long time many years but the politicians havent done anything about it
           
           Now in all fairness to Secretary Clinton -- yes is that OK? Good I want you to be very happy Its very important to me
           
           But in all fairness to Secretary Clinton when she started talking about this it was really very recently Shes been doing this for 30 years And why hasnt she made the agreements better? The NAFTA agreement is defective Just because of the tax and many other reasons but just because of the fact
           
           HOLT: Let me interrupt just a moment but
           
           TRUMP: Secretary Clinton and others politicians should have been doing this for years not right now because of the fact that weve created a movement They should have been doing this for years Whats happened to our jobs and our country and our economy generally is -- look we owe 20 trillion We cannot do it any longer Lester HOLT: Back to the question though How do you bring back -- specifically bring back jobs American manufacturers? How do you make them bring the jobs back?
           
           TRUMP: Well the first thing you do is dont let the jobs leave The companies are leaving I could name I mean there are thousands of them Theyre leaving and theyre leaving in bigger numbers than ever
           
           And what you do is you say fine you want to go to Mexico or some other country good luck We wish you a lot of luck But if you think youre going to make your air conditioners or your cars or your cookies or whatever you make and bring them into our country without a tax youre wrong
           
           And once you say youre going to have to tax them coming in and our politicians never do this because they have special interests and the special interests want those companies to leave because in many cases they own the companies So what Im saying is we can stop them from leaving We have to stop them from leaving And thats a big big factor
           
           HOLT: Let me let Secretary Clinton get in here
           
           CLINTON: Well lets stop for a second and remember where we were eight years ago We had the worst financial crisis the Great Recession the worst since the 1930s That was in large part because of tax policies that slashed taxes on the wealthy failed to invest in the middle class took their eyes off of Wall Street and created a perfect storm
           
           In fact Donald was one of the people who rooted for the housing crisis He said back in 2006 Gee I hope it does collapse because then I can go in and buy some and make some money Well it did collapse
           
           TRUMP: Thats called business by the way
           
           CLINTON: Nine million people -- nine million people lost their jobs Five million people lost their homes And 13 trillion in family wealth was wiped out
           
           Now we have come back from that abyss And it has not been easy So were now on the precipice of having a potentially much better economy but the last thing we need to do is to go back to the policies that failed us in the first place
           
           Independent experts have looked at what Ive proposed and looked at what Donalds proposed and basically theyve said this that if his tax plan which would blow up the debt by over 5 trillion and would in some instances disadvantage middle-class families compared to the wealthy were to go into effect we would lose 35 million jobs and maybe have another recession
           
           Theyve looked at my plans and theyve said OK if we can do this and I intend to get it done we will have 10 million more new jobs because we will be making investments where we can grow the economy Take clean energy Some country is going to be the clean- energy superpower of the 21st century Donald thinks that climate change is a hoax perpetrated by the Chinese I think its real
           
           TRUMP: I did not I did not I do not say that
           
           CLINTON: I think science is real
           
           TRUMP: I do not say that
           
           CLINTON: And I think its important that we grip this and deal with it both at home and abroad And heres what we can do We can deploy a half a billion more solar panels We can have enough clean energy to power every home We can build a new modern electric grid Thats a lot of jobs; thats a lot of new economic activity
           
           So Ive tried to be very specific about what we can and should do and I am determined that were going to get the economy really moving again building on the progress weve made over the last eight years but never going back to what got us in trouble in the first place
           
           HOLT: Mr Trump?
           
           TRUMP: She talks about solar panels We invested in a solar company our country That was a disaster They lost plenty of money on that one
           
           Now look Im a great believer in all forms of energy but were putting a lot of people out of work Our energy policies are a disaster Our country is losing so much in terms of energy in terms of paying off our debt You cant do what youre looking to do with 20 trillion in debt
           
           The Obama administration from the time theyve come in is over 230 years worth of debt and hes topped it Hes doubled it in a course of almost eight years seven-and-a-half years to be semi- exact
           
           So I will tell you this We have to do a much better job at keeping our jobs And we have to do a much better job at giving companies incentives to build new companies or to expand because theyre not doing it
           
           And all you have to do is look at Michigan and look at Ohio and look at all of these places where so many of their jobs and their companies are just leaving theyre gone
           
           And Hillary Id just ask you this Youve been doing this for 30 years Why are you just thinking about these solutions right now? For 30 years youve been doing it and now youre just starting to think of solutions
           
           CLINTON: Well actually
           
           TRUMP: I will bring -- excuse me I will bring back jobs You cant bring back jobs
           
           CLINTON: Well actually I have thought about this quite a bit
           
           TRUMP: Yeah for 30 years
           
           CLINTON: And I have -- well not quite that long I think my husband did a pretty good job in the 1990s I think a lot about what worked and how we can make it work again
           
           TRUMP: Well he approved NAFTA
           
           (CROSSTALK)
           
           CLINTON:  million new jobs a balanced budget
           
           TRUMP: He approved NAFTA which is the single worst trade deal ever approved in this country
           
           CLINTON: Incomes went up for everybody Manufacturing jobs went up also in the 1990s if were actually going to look at the facts
           
           When I was in the Senate I had a number of trade deals that came before me and I held them all to the same test Will they create jobs in America? Will they raise incomes in America? And are they good for our national security? Some of them I voted for The biggest one a multinational one known as CAFTA I voted against And because I hold the same standards as I look at all of these trade deals
           
           But lets not assume that trade is the only challenge we have in the economy I think it is a part of it and Ive said what Im going to do Im going to have a special prosecutor Were going to enforce the trade deals we have and were going to hold people accountable
           
           When I was secretary of state we actually increased American exports globally 30 percent We increased them to China 50 percent So I know how to really work to get new jobs and to get exports that helped to create more new jobs
           
           HOLT: Very quickly
           
           TRUMP: But you havent done it in 30 years or 26 years or any number you want to
           
           CLINTON: Well Ive been a senator Donald
           
           TRUMP: You havent done it You havent done it
           
           CLINTON: And I have been a secretary of state
           
           TRUMP: Excuse me
           
           CLINTON: And I have done a lot
           
           TRUMP: Your husband signed NAFTA which was one of the worst things that ever happened to the manufacturing industry
           
           CLINTON: Well thats your opinion That is your opinion
           
           TRUMP: You go to New England you go to Ohio Pennsylvania you go anywhere you want Secretary Clinton and you will see devastation where manufacture is down 30 40 sometimes 50 percent NAFTA is the worst trade deal maybe ever signed anywhere but certainly ever signed in this country
           
           And now you want to approve Trans-Pacific Partnership You were totally in favor of it Then you heard what I was saying how bad it is and you said I cant win that debate But you know that if you did win you would approve that and that will be almost as bad as NAFTA Nothing will ever top NAFTA
           
           CLINTON: Well that is just not accurate I was against it once it was finally negotiated and the terms were laid out I wrote about that in
           
           TRUMP: You called it the gold standard
           
           (CROSSTALK)
           
           TRUMP: You called it the gold standard of trade deals You said its the finest deal youve ever seen
           
           CLINTON: No
           
           TRUMP: And then you heard what I said about it and all of a sudden you were against it
           
           CLINTON: Well Donald I know you live in your own reality but that is not the facts The facts are -- I did say I hoped it would be a good deal but when it was negotiated
           
           TRUMP: Not
           
           CLINTON:  which I was not responsible for I concluded it wasnt I wrote about that in my book
           
           TRUMP: So is it President Obamas fault?
           
           CLINTON:  before you even announced
           
           TRUMP: Is it President Obamas fault?
           
           CLINTON: Look there are differences
           
           TRUMP: Secretary is it President Obamas fault?
           
           CLINTON: There are
           
           TRUMP: Because hes pushing it
           
           CLINTON: There are different views about whats good for our country our economy and our leadership in the world And I think its important to look at what we need to do to get the economy going again Thats why I said new jobs with rising incomes investments not in more tax cuts that would add 5 trillion to the debt
           
           TRUMP: But you have no plan
           
           CLINTON: But in -- oh but I do
           
           TRUMP: Secretary you have no plan
           
           CLINTON: In fact I have written a book about it Its called Stronger Together You can pick it up tomorrow at a bookstore
           
           TRUMP: Thats about all youve
           
           (CROSSTALK)
           
           HOLT: Folks were going to
           
           CLINTON:  or at an airport near you
           
           HOLT: Were going to move to
           
           CLINTON: But its because I see this -- we need to have strong growth fair growth sustained growth We also have to look at how we help families balance the responsibilities at home and the responsibilities at business
           
           So we have a very robust set of plans And people have looked at both of our plans have concluded that mine would create 10 million jobs and yours would lose us 35 million jobs and explode the debt which would have a recession
           
           TRUMP: You are going to approve one of the biggest tax cuts in history You are going to approve one of the biggest tax increases in history You are going to drive business out Your regulations are a disaster and youre going to increase regulations all over the place
           
           And by the way my tax cut is the biggest since Ronald Reagan Im very proud of it It will create tremendous numbers of new jobs But regulations you are going to regulate these businesses out of existence
           
           When I go around -- Lester I tell you this Ive been all over And when I go around despite the tax cut the thing -- the things that business as in people like the most is the fact that Im cutting regulation You have regulations on top of regulations and new companies cannot form and old companies are going out of business And you want to increase the regulations and make them even worse
           
           Im going to cut regulations Im going to cut taxes big league and youre going to raise taxes big league end of story
           
           HOLT: Let me get you to pause right there because were going to move into -- were going to move into the next segment Were going to talk taxes
           
           CLINTON: That cant -- that cant be left to stand
           
           HOLT: Please just take 30 seconds and then were going to go on
           
           CLINTON: I kind of assumed that there would be a lot of these charges and claims and so
           
           TRUMP: Facts
           
           CLINTON: So we have taken the home page of my website HillaryClintoncom and weve turned it into a fact-checker So if you want to see in real-time what the facts are please go and take a look Because what I have proposed
           
           TRUMP: And take a look at mine also and youll see
           
           CLINTON:  would not add a penny to the debt and your plans would add 5 trillion to the debt What I have proposed would cut regulations and streamline them for small businesses What I have proposed would be paid for by raising taxes on the wealthy because they have made all the gains in the economy And I think its time that the wealthy and corporations paid their fair share to support this country
           
           HOLT: Well you just opened the next segment
           
           TRUMP: Well could I just finish -- I think I
           
           (CROSSTALK)
           
           HOLT: Im going to give you a chance right here
           
           TRUMP: I think I should -- you go to her website and you take a look at her website
           
           HOLT:  with a new 15-minute segment
           
           TRUMP: Shes going to raise taxes 13 trillion
           
           HOLT: Mr Trump Im going to
           
           TRUMP: And look at her website You know what? Its no difference than this Shes telling us how to fight ISIS Just go to her website She tells you how to fight ISIS on her website I dont think General Douglas MacArthur would like that too much
           
           HOLT: The next segment were continuing
           
           CLINTON: Well at least I have a plan to fight ISIS
           
           HOLT:  achieving prosperity
           
           TRUMP: No no youre telling the enemy everything you want to do
           
           CLINTON: No were not No were not
           
           TRUMP: See youre telling the enemy everything you want to do No wonder youve been fighting -- no wonder youve been fighting ISIS your entire adult life
           
           CLINTON: Thats a -- thats -- go to the -- please fact checkers get to work
           
           HOLT: OK you are unpacking a lot here And were still on the issue of achieving prosperity And I want to talk about taxes The fundamental difference between the two of you concerns the wealthy
           
           Secretary Clinton youre calling for a tax increase on the wealthiest Americans Id like you to further defend that And Mr Trump youre calling for tax cuts for the wealthy Id like you to defend that And this next two-minute answer goes to you Mr Trump
           
           TRUMP: Well Im really calling for major jobs because the wealthy are going create tremendous jobs Theyre going to expand their companies Theyre going to do a tremendous job
           
           Im getting rid of the carried interest provision And if you really look its not a tax -- its really not a great thing for the wealthy Its a great thing for the middle class Its a great thing for companies to expand
           
           And when these people are going to put billions and billions of dollars into companies and when theyre going to bring 25 trillion back from overseas where they cant bring the money back because politicians like Secretary Clinton wont allow them to bring the money back because the taxes are so onerous and the bureaucratic red tape so what -- is so bad
           
           So what theyre doing is theyre leaving our country and theyre believe it or not leaving because taxes are too high and because some of them have lots of money outside of our country And instead of bringing it back and putting the money to work because they cant work out a deal to -- and everybody agrees it should be brought back
           
           Instead of that theyre leaving our country to get their money because they cant bring their money back into our country because of bureaucratic red tape because they cant get together Because we have -- we have a president that cant sit them around a table and get them to approve something
           
           And heres the thing Republicans and Democrats agree that this should be done 25 trillion I happen to think its double that Its probably 5 trillion that we cant bring into our country Lester And with a little leadership youd get it in here very quickly and it could be put to use on the inner cities and lots of other things and it would be beautiful
           
           But we have no leadership And honestly that starts with Secretary Clinton
           
           HOLT: All right You have two minutes of the same question to defend tax increases on the wealthiest Americans Secretary Clinton
           
           CLINTON: I have a feeling that by the end of this evening Im going to be blamed for everything thats ever happened
           
           TRUMP: Why not?
           
           CLINTON: Why not? Yeah why not?
           
           (LAUGHTER)
           
           You know just join the debate by saying more crazy things Now let me say this it is absolutely the case
           
           TRUMP: Theres nothing crazy about not letting our companies bring their money back into their country
           
           HOLT: This is -- this is Secretary Clintons two minutes please
           
           TRUMP: Yes
           
           CLINTON: Yeah well lets start the clock again Lester Weve looked at your tax proposals I dont see changes in the corporate tax rates or the kinds of proposals youre referring to that would cause the repatriation bringing back of money thats stranded overseas I happen to support that
           
           TRUMP: Then you didnt read it
           
           CLINTON: I happen to -- I happen to support that in a way that will actually work to our benefit But when I look at what you have proposed you have what is called now the Trump loophole because it would so advantage you and the business you do Youve proposed an approach that has a
           
           TRUMP: Who gave it that name? The first Ive -- who gave it that name?
           
           (CROSSTALK)
           
           HOLT: Mr Trump this is Secretary Clintons two minutes
           
           CLINTON:  4 billion tax benefit for your family And when you look at what you are proposing
           
           TRUMP: How much? How much for my family? CLINTON:  it is
           
           TRUMP: Lester how much?
           
           CLINTON:  as I said trumped-up trickle-down Trickle-down did not work It got us into the mess we were in in 2008 and 2009 Slashing taxes on the wealthy hasnt worked
           
           And a lot of really smart wealthy people know that And they are saying hey we need to do more to make the contributions we should be making to rebuild the middle class
           
           CLINTON: I dont think top-down works in America I think building the middle class investing in the middle class making college debt-free so more young people can get their education helping people refinance their -- their debt from college at a lower rate Those are the kinds of things that will really boost the economy Broad-based inclusive growth is what we need in America not more advantages for people at the very top
           
           HOLT: Mr Trump were
           
           TRUMP: Typical politician All talk no action Sounds good doesnt work Never going to happen Our country is suffering because people like Secretary Clinton have made such bad decisions in terms of our jobs and in terms of whats going on
           
           Now look we have the worst revival of an economy since the Great Depression And believe me: Were in a bubble right now And the only thing that looks good is the stock market but if you raise interest rates even a little bit thats going to come crashing down
           
           We are in a big fat ugly bubble And we better be awfully careful And we have a Fed thats doing political things This Janet Yellen of the Fed The Fed is doing political -- by keeping the interest rates at this level And believe me: The day Obama goes off and he leaves and goes out to the golf course for the rest of his life to play golf when they raise interest rates youre going to see some very bad things happen because the Fed is not doing their job The Fed is being more political than Secretary Clinton
           
           HOLT: Mr Trump were talking about the burden that Americans have to pay yet you have not released your tax returns And the reason nominees have released their returns for decades is so that voters will know if their potential president owes money to -- who he owes it to and any business conflicts Dont Americans have a right to know if there are any conflicts of interest?
           
           TRUMP: I dont mind releasing -- Im under a routine audit And itll be released And -- as soon as the audits finished it will be released
           
           But you will learn more about Donald Trump by going down to the federal elections where I filed a 104-page essentially financial statement of sorts the forms that they have It shows income -- in fact the income -- I just looked today -- the income is filed at 694 million for this past year 694 million If you would have told me I was going to make that 15 or 20 years ago I would have been very surprised
           
           But thats the kind of thinking that our country needs When we have a country thats doing so badly thats being ripped off by every single country in the world its the kind of thinking that our country needs because everybody -- Lester we have a trade deficit with all of the countries that we do business with of almost 800 billion a year You know what that is? That means whos negotiating these trade deals?
           
           We have people that are political hacks negotiating our trade deals
           
           HOLT: The IRS says an audit
           
           TRUMP: Excuse me
           
           HOLT:  of your taxes -- youre perfectly free to release your taxes during an audit And so the question does the publics right to know outweigh your personal
           
           TRUMP: Well I told you I will release them as soon as the audit Look Ive been under audit almost for 15 years I know a lot of wealthy people that have never been audited I said do you get audited? I get audited almost every year
           
           And in a way I should be complaining Im not even complaining I dont mind it Its almost become a way of life I get audited by the IRS But other people dont
           
           I will say this We have a situation in this country that has to be taken care of I will release my tax returns -- against my lawyers wishes -- when she releases her 33000 e-mails that have been deleted As soon as she releases them I will release
           
           (APPLAUSE)
           
           I will release my tax returns And thats against -- my lawyers they say Dont do it I will tell you this No -- in fact watching shows theyre reading the papers Almost every lawyer says you dont release your returns until the audits complete When the audits complete Ill do it But I would go against them if she releases her e-mails
           
           HOLT: So its negotiable?
           
           TRUMP: Its not negotiable no Let her release the e-mails Why did she delete 33000
           
           HOLT: Well Ill let her answer that But let me just admonish the audience one more time There was an agreement We did ask you to be silent so it would be helpful for us Secretary Clinton?
           
           CLINTON: Well I think youve seen another example of bait-and- switch here For 40 years everyone running for president has released their tax returns You can go and see nearly I think 39 40 years of our tax returns but everyone has done it We know the IRS has made clear there is no prohibition on releasing it when youre under audit
           
           So youve got to ask yourself why wont he release his tax returns? And I think there may be a couple of reasons First maybe hes not as rich as he says he is Second maybe hes not as charitable as he claims to be
           
           CLINTON: Third we dont know all of his business dealings but we have been told through investigative reporting that he owes about 650 million to Wall Street and foreign banks Or maybe he doesnt want the American people all of you watching tonight to know that hes paid nothing in federal taxes because the only years that anybodys ever seen were a couple of years when he had to turn them over to state authorities when he was trying to get a casino license and they showed he didnt pay any federal income tax
           
           TRUMP: That makes me smart
           
           CLINTON: So if hes paid zero that means zero for troops zero for vets zero for schools or health And I think probably hes not all that enthusiastic about having the rest of our country see what the real reasons are because it must be something really important even terrible that hes trying to hide
           
           And the financial disclosure statements they dont give you the tax rate They dont give you all the details that tax returns would And it just seems to me that this is something that the American people deserve to see And I have no reason to believe that hes ever going to release his tax returns because theres something hes hiding
           
           And well guess Well keep guessing at what it might be that hes hiding But I think the question is were he ever to get near the White House what would be those conflicts? Who does he owe money to? Well he owes you the answers to that and he should provide them
           
           HOLT: He also -- he also raised the issue of your e-mails Do you want to respond to that?
           
           CLINTON: I do You know I made a mistake using a private e- mail TRUMP: Thats for sure
           
           CLINTON: And if I had to do it over again I would obviously do it differently But Im not going to make any excuses It was a mistake and I take responsibility for that
           
           HOLT: Mr Trump?
           
           TRUMP: That was more than a mistake That was done purposely OK? That was not a mistake That was done purposely When you have your staff taking the Fifth Amendment taking the Fifth so theyre not prosecuted when you have the man that set up the illegal server taking the Fifth I think its disgraceful And believe me this country thinks its -- really thinks its disgraceful also
           
           As far as my tax returns you dont learn that much from tax returns That I can tell you You learn a lot from financial disclosure And you should go down and take a look at that
           
           The other thing Im extremely underleveraged The report that said 650 -- which by the way a lot of friends of mine that know my business say boy thats really not a lot of money Its not a lot of money relative to what I had
           
           The buildings that were in question they said in the same report which was -- actually it wasnt even a bad story to be honest with you but the buildings are worth 39 billion And the 650 isnt even on that But its not 650 Its much less than that
           
           But I could give you a list of banks I would -- if that would help you I would give you a list of banks These are very fine institutions very fine banks I could do that very quickly
           
           I am very underleveraged I have a great company I have a tremendous income And the reason I say that is not in a braggadocios way Its because its about time that this country had somebody running it that has an idea about money
           
           When we have 20 trillion in debt and our countrys a mess you know its one thing to have 20 trillion in debt and our roads are good and our bridges are good and everythings in great shape our airports Our airports are like from a third world country
           
           You land at LaGuardia you land at Kennedy you land at LAX you land at Newark and you come in from Dubai and Qatar and you see these incredible -- you come in from China you see these incredible airports and you land -- weve become a third world country
           
           So the worst of all things has happened We owe 20 trillion and were a mess We havent even started And weve spent 6 trillion in the Middle East according to a report that I just saw Whether its 6 or 5 but it looks like its 6 6 trillion in the Middle East we could have rebuilt our country twice
           
           And its really a shame And its politicians like Secretary Clinton that have caused this problem Our country has tremendous problems Were a debtor nation Were a serious debtor nation And we have a country that needs new roads new tunnels new bridges new airports new schools new hospitals And we dont have the money because its been squandered on so many of your ideas
           
           HOLT: Well let you respond and well move on to the next segment
           
           CLINTON: And maybe because you havent paid any federal income tax for a lot of years (APPLAUSE)
           
           And the other thing I think is important
           
           TRUMP: It would be squandered too believe me
           
           CLINTON:  is if your -- if your main claim to be president of the United States is your business then I think we should talk about that You know your campaign manager said that you built a lot of businesses on the backs of little guys
           
           And indeed I have met a lot of the people who were stiffed by you and your businesses Donald Ive met dishwashers painters architects glass installers marble installers drapery installers like my dad was who you refused to pay when they finished the work that you asked them to do
           
           We have an architect in the audience who designed one of your clubhouses at one of your golf courses Its a beautiful facility It immediately was put to use And you wouldnt pay what the man needed to be paid what he was charging you to do
           
           TRUMP: Maybe he didnt do a good job and I was unsatisfied with his work
           
           CLINTON: Well to
           
           TRUMP: Which our country should do too
           
           CLINTON: Do the thousands of people that you have stiffed over the course of your business not deserve some kind of apology from someone who has taken their labor taken the goods that they produced and then refused to pay them?
           
           I can only say that Im certainly relieved that my late father never did business with you He provided a good middle-class life for us but the people he worked for he expected the bargain to be kept on both sides
           
           And when we talk about your business youve taken business bankruptcy six times There are a lot of great businesspeople that have never taken bankruptcy once You call yourself the King of Debt You talk about leverage You even at one time suggested that you would try to negotiate down the national debt of the United States
           
           TRUMP: Wrong Wrong
           
           CLINTON: Well sometimes theres not a direct transfer of skills from business to government but sometimes what happened in business would be really bad for government
           
           HOLT: Lets let Mr Trump
           
           CLINTON: And we need to be very clear about that
           
           TRUMP: So yeah I think -- I do think its time Look its all words its all sound bites I built an unbelievable company Some of the greatest assets anywhere in the world real estate assets anywhere in the world beyond the United States in Europe lots of different places Its an unbelievable company
           
           But on occasion four times we used certain laws that are there And when Secretary Clinton talks about people that didnt get paid first of all they did get paid a lot but taken advantage of the laws of the nation
           
           Now if you want to change the laws youve been there a long time change the laws But I take advantage of the laws of the nation because Im running a company My obligation right now is to do well for myself my family my employees for my companies And thats what I do
           
           But what she doesnt say is that tens of thousands of people that are unbelievably happy and that love me Ill give you an example Were just opening up on Pennsylvania Avenue right next to the White House so if I dont get there one way Im going to get to Pennsylvania Avenue another
           
           But were opening the Old Post Office Under budget ahead of schedule saved tremendous money Im a year ahead of schedule And thats what this country should be doing
           
           We build roads and they cost two and three and four times what theyre supposed to cost We buy products for our military and they come in at costs that are so far above what they were supposed to be because we dont have people that know what theyre doing
           
           When we look at the budget the budget is bad to a large extent because we have people that have no idea as to what to do and how to buy The Trump International is way under budget and way ahead of schedule And we should be able to do that for our country
           
           HOLT: Well were well behind schedule so I want to move to our next segment We move into our next segment talking about Americas direction And lets start by talking about race
           
           The share of Americans who say race relations are bad in this country is the highest its been in decades much of it amplified by shootings of African-Americans by police as weve seen recently in Charlotte and Tulsa Race has been a big issue in this campaign and one of you is going to have to bridge a very wide and bitter gap
           
           So how do you heal the divide? Secretary Clinton you get two minutes on this
           
           CLINTON: Well youre right Race remains a significant challenge in our country Unfortunately race still determines too much often determines where people live determines what kind of education in their public schools they can get and yes it determines how theyre treated in the criminal justice system Weve just seen those two tragic examples in both Tulsa and Charlotte
           
           And weve got to do several things at the same time We have to restore trust between communities and the police We have to work to make sure that our police are using the best training the best techniques that theyre well prepared to use force only when necessary Everyone should be respected by the law and everyone should respect the law
           
           CLINTON: Right now thats not the case in a lot of our neighborhoods So I have ever since the first day of my campaign called for criminal justice reform Ive laid out a platform that I think would begin to remedy some of the problems we have in the criminal justice system
           
           But we also have to recognize in addition to the challenges that we face with policing there are so many good brave police officers who equally want reform So we have to bring communities together in order to begin working on that as a mutual goal And weve got to get guns out of the hands of people who should not have them
           
           The gun epidemic is the leading cause of death of young African- American men more than the next nine causes put together So we have to do two things as I said We have to restore trust We have to work with the police We have to make sure they respect the communities and the communities respect them And we have to tackle the plague of gun violence which is a big contributor to a lot of the problems that were seeing today
           
           HOLT: All right Mr Trump you have two minutes How do you heal the divide?
           
           TRUMP: Well first of all Secretary Clinton doesnt want to use a couple of words and thats law and order And we need law and order If we dont have it were not going to have a country
           
           And when I look at whats going on in Charlotte a city I love a city where I have investments when I look at whats going on throughout various parts of our country whether its -- I mean I can just keep naming them all day long -- we need law and order in our country
           
           I just got today the as you know the endorsement of the Fraternal Order of Police we just -- just came in We have endorsements from I think almost every police group very -- I mean a large percentage of them in the United States
           
           We have a situation where we have our inner cities African- Americans Hispanics are living in hell because its so dangerous You walk down the street you get shot
           
           In Chicago theyve had thousands of shootings thousands since January 1st Thousands of shootings And Im saying where is this? Is this a war-torn country? What are we doing? And we have to stop the violence We have to bring back law and order In a place like Chicago where thousands of people have been killed thousands over the last number of years in fact almost 4000 have been killed since Barack Obama became president over -- almost 4000 people in Chicago have been killed We have to bring back law and order
           
           Now whether or not in a place like Chicago you do stop and frisk which worked very well Mayor Giuliani is here worked very well in New York It brought the crime rate way down But you take the gun away from criminals that shouldnt be having it
           
           We have gangs roaming the street And in many cases theyre illegally here illegal immigrants And they have guns And they shoot people And we have to be very strong And we have to be very vigilant
           
           We have to be -- we have to know what were doing Right now our police in many cases are afraid to do anything We have to protect our inner cities because African-American communities are being decimated by crime decimated
           
           HOLT: Your two -- your two minutes expired but I do want to follow up Stop-and-frisk was ruled unconstitutional in New York because it largely singled out black and Hispanic young men
           
           TRUMP: No youre wrong It went before a judge who was a very against-police judge It was taken away from her And our mayor our new mayor refused to go forward with the case They would have won an appeal If you look at it throughout the country there are many places where its allowed
           
           HOLT: The argument is that its a form of racial profiling
           
           TRUMP: No the argument is that we have to take the guns away from these people that have them and they are bad people that shouldnt have them
           
           These are felons These are people that are bad people that shouldnt be -- when you have 3000 shootings in Chicago from January 1st when you have 4000 people killed in Chicago by guns from the beginning of the presidency of Barack Obama his hometown you have to have stop-and-frisk
           
           You need more police You need a better community you know relation You dont have good community relations in Chicago Its terrible I have property there Its terrible whats going on in Chicago
           
           But when you look -- and Chicagos not the only -- you go to Ferguson you go to so many different places You need better relationships I agree with Secretary Clinton on this
           
           TRUMP: You need better relationships between the communities and the police because in some cases its not good
           
           But you look at Dallas where the relationships were really studied the relationships were really a beautiful thing and then five police officers were killed one night very violently So theres some bad things going on Some really bad things
           
           HOLT: Secretary Clinton
           
           TRUMP: But we need -- Lester we need law and order And we need law and order in the inner cities because the people that are most affected by whats happening are African-American and Hispanic people And its very unfair to them what our politicians are allowing to happen
           
           HOLT: Secretary Clinton?
           
           CLINTON: Well Ive heard -- Ive heard Donald say this at his rallies and its really unfortunate that he paints such a dire negative picture of black communities in our country
           
           TRUMP: Ugh
           
           CLINTON: You know the vibrancy of the black church the black businesses that employ so many people the opportunities that so many families are working to provide for their kids Theres a lot that we should be proud of and we should be supporting and lifting up
           
           But we do always have to make sure we keep people safe There are the right ways of doing it and then there are ways that are ineffective Stop-and-frisk was found to be unconstitutional and in part because it was ineffective It did not do what it needed to do
           
           Now I believe in community policing And in fact violent crime is one-half of what it was in 1991 Property crime is down 40 percent We just dont want to see it creep back up Weve had 25 years of very good cooperation
           
           But there were some problems some unintended consequences Too many young African-American and Latino men ended up in jail for nonviolent offenses And its just a fact that if youre a young African-American man and you do the same thing as a young white man you are more likely to be arrested charged convicted and incarcerated So weve got to address the systemic racism in our criminal justice system We cannot just say law and order We have to say -- we have to come forward with a plan that is going to divert people from the criminal justice system deal with mandatory minimum sentences which have put too many people away for too long for doing too little
           
           We need to have more second chance programs Im glad that were ending private prisons in the federal system; I want to see them ended in the state system You shouldnt have a profit motivation to fill prison cells with young Americans So there are some positive ways we can work on this
           
           And I believe strongly that commonsense gun safety measures would assist us Right now -- and this is something Donald has supported along with the gun lobby -- right now weve got too many military- style weapons on the streets In a lot of places our police are outgunned We need comprehensive background checks and we need to keep guns out of the hands of those who will do harm
           
           And we finally need to pass a prohibition on anyone whos on the terrorist watch list from being able to buy a gun in our country If youre too dangerous to fly you are too dangerous to buy a gun So there are things we can do and we ought to do it in a bipartisan way
           
           HOLT: Secretary Clinton last week you said weve got to do everything possible to improve policing to go right at implicit bias Do you believe that police are implicitly biased against black people?
           
           CLINTON: Lester I think implicit bias is a problem for everyone not just police I think unfortunately too many of us in our great country jump to conclusions about each other And therefore I think we need all of us to be asking hard questions about you know why am I feeling this way?
           
           But when it comes to policing since it can have literally fatal consequences I have said in my first budget we would put money into that budget to help us deal with implicit bias by retraining a lot of our police officers
           
           Ive met with a group of very distinguished experienced police chiefs a few weeks ago They admit its an issue Theyve got a lot of concerns Mental health is one of the biggest concerns because now police are having to handle a lot of really difficult mental health problems on the street
           
           CLINTON: They want support they want more training they want more assistance And I think the federal government could be in a position where we would offer and provide that
           
           HOLT: Mr Trump
           
           TRUMP: Id like to respond to that
           
           HOLT: Please
           
           TRUMP: First of all I agree and a lot of people even within my own party want to give certain rights to people on watch lists and no- fly lists I agree with you When a person is on a watch list or a no-fly list and I have the endorsement of the NRA which Im very proud of These are very very good people and theyre protecting the Second Amendment
           
           But I think we have to look very strongly at no-fly lists and watch lists And when people are on there even if they shouldnt be on there well help them well help them legally well help them get off But I tend to agree with that quite strongly
           
           I do want to bring up the fact that you were the one that brought up the words super-predator about young black youth And thats a term that I think was a -- its -- its been horribly met as you know I think youve apologized for it But I think it was a terrible thing to say
           
           And when it comes to stop-and-frisk you know youre talking about takes guns away Well Im talking about taking guns away from gangs and people that use them And I dont think -- I really dont think you disagree with me on this if you want to know the truth
           
           I think maybe theres a political reason why you cant say it but I really dont believe -- in New York City stop-and-frisk we had 2200 murders and stop-and-frisk brought it down to 500 murders Five hundred murders is a lot of murders Its hard to believe 500 is like supposed to be good?
           
           But we went from 2200 to 500 And it was continued on by Mayor Bloomberg And it was terminated by current mayor But stop-and- frisk had a tremendous impact on the safety of New York City Tremendous beyond belief So when you say it has no impact it really did It had a very very big impact
           
           CLINTON: Well its also fair to say if were going to talk about mayors that under the current mayor crime has continued to drop including murders So there is
           
           TRUMP: No youre wrong Youre wrong
           
           CLINTON: No Im not
           
           TRUMP: Murders are up All right You check it
           
           CLINTON: New York -- New York has done an excellent job And I give credit -- I give credit across the board going back two mayors two police chiefs because it has worked And other communities need to come together to do what will work as well
           
           Look one murder is too many But it is important that we learn about what has been effective And not go to things that sound good that really did not have the kind of impact that we would want Who disagrees with keeping neighborhoods safe?
           
           But lets also add no one should disagree about respecting the rights of young men who live in those neighborhoods And so we need to do a better job of working again with the communities faith communities business communities as well as the police to try to deal with this problem
           
           HOLT: This conversation is about race And so Mr Trump I have to ask you for five
           
           TRUMP: Id like to just respond if I might
           
           HOLT: Please -- 20 seconds
           
           TRUMP: Id just like to respond
           
           HOLT: Please respond then Ive got a quick follow-up for you
           
           TRUMP: I will Look the African-American community has been let down by our politicians They talk good around election time like right now and after the election they said see ya later Ill see you in four years
           
           The African-American community -- because -- look the community within the inner cities has been so badly treated Theyve been abused and used in order to get votes by Democrat politicians because thats what it is Theyve controlled these communities for up to 100 years
           
           HOLT: Mr Trump let me
           
           (CROSSTALK)
           
           CLINTON: Well I -- I do think
           
           TRUMP: And I will tell you you look at the inner cities -- and I just left Detroit and I just left Philadelphia and I just -- you know youve seen me Ive been all over the place You decided to stay home and thats OK But I will tell you Ive been all over And Ive met some of the greatest people Ill ever meet within these communities And they are very very upset with what their politicians have told them and what their politicians have done
           
           HOLT: Mr Trump I
           
           CLINTON: I think -- I think -- I think Donald just criticized me for preparing for this debate And yes I did And you know what else I prepared for? I prepared to be president And I think thats a good thing
           
           (APPLAUSE)
           
           HOLT: Mr Trump for five years you perpetuated a false claim that the nations first black president was not a natural-born citizen You questioned his legitimacy In the last couple of weeks you acknowledged what most Americans have accepted for years: The president was born in the United States Can you tell us what took you so long?
           
           TRUMP: Ill tell you very -- well just very simple to say Sidney Blumenthal works for the campaign and close -- very close friend of Secretary Clinton And her campaign manager Patti Doyle went to -- during the campaign her campaign against President Obama fought very hard And you can go look it up and you can check it out
           
           TRUMP: And if you look at CNN this past week Patti Solis Doyle was on Wolf Blitzer saying that this happened Blumenthal sent McClatchy highly respected reporter at McClatchy to Kenya to find out about it They were pressing it very hard She failed to get the birth certificate
           
           When I got involved I didnt fail I got him to give the birth certificate So Im satisfied with it And Ill tell you why Im satisfied with it
           
           HOLT: That was
           
           (CROSSTALK)
           
           TRUMP: Because I want to get on to defeating ISIS because I want to get on to creating jobs because I want to get on to having a strong border because I want to get on to things that are very important to me and that are very important to the country
           
           HOLT: I will let you respond Its important But I just want to get the answer here The birth certificate was produced in 2011 Youve continued to tell the story and question the presidents legitimacy in 2012 13 14 15
           
           TRUMP: Yeah
           
           HOLT:  as recently as January So the question is what changed your mind?
           
           TRUMP: Well nobody was pressing it nobody was caring much about it I figured youd ask the question tonight of course But nobody was caring much about it But I was the one that got him to produce the birth certificate And I think I did a good job
           
           Secretary Clinton also fought it I mean you know -- now everybody in mainstream is going to say oh thats not true Look its true Sidney Blumenthal sent a reporter -- you just have to take a look at CNN the last week the interview with your former campaign manager And she was involved But just like she cant bring back jobs she cant produce
           
           HOLT: Im sorry Im just going to follow up -- and I will let you respond to that because theres a lot there But were talking about racial healing in this segment What do you say to Americans people of color who
           
           (CROSSTALK)
           
           TRUMP: Well it was very -- I say nothing I say nothing because I was able to get him to produce it He should have produced it a long time before I say nothing
           
           But let me just tell you When you talk about healing I think that Ive developed very very good relationships over the last little while with the African-American community I think you can see that
           
           And I feel that they really wanted me to come to that conclusion And I think I did a great job and a great service not only for the country but even for the president in getting him to produce his birth certificate
           
           HOLT: Secretary Clinton?
           
           CLINTON: Well just listen to what you heard
           
           (LAUGHTER)
           
           And clearly as Donald just admitted he knew he was going to stand on this debate stage and Lester Holt was going to be asking us questions so he tried to put the whole racist birther lie to bed
           
           But it cant be dismissed that easily He has really started his political activity based on this racist lie that our first black president was not an American citizen There was absolutely no evidence for it but he persisted he persisted year after year because some of his supporters people that he was trying to bring into his fold apparently believed it or wanted to believe it
           
           But remember Donald started his career back in 1973 being sued by the Justice Department for racial discrimination because he would not rent apartments in one of his developments to African-Americans and he made sure that the people who worked for him understood that was the policy He actually was sued twice by the Justice Department
           
           So he has a long record of engaging in racist behavior And the birther lie was a very hurtful one You know Barack Obama is a man of great dignity And I could tell how much it bothered him and annoyed him that this was being touted and used against him
           
           But I like to remember what Michelle Obama said in her amazing speech at our Democratic National Convention: When they go low we go high And Barack Obama went high despite Donald Trumps best efforts to bring him down
           
           HOLT: Mr Trump you can respond and were going to move on to the next segment
           
           TRUMP: I would love to respond First of all I got to watch in preparing for this some of your debates against Barack Obama You treated him with terrible disrespect And I watched the way you talk now about how lovely everything is and how wonderful you are It doesnt work that way You were after him you were trying to -- you even sent out or your campaign sent out pictures of him in a certain garb very famous pictures I dont think you can deny that
           
           But just last week your campaign manager said it was true So when you tried to act holier than thou it really doesnt work It really doesnt
           
           Now as far as the lawsuit yes when I was very young I went into my fathers company had a real estate company in Brooklyn and Queens and we along with many many other companies throughout the country -- it was a federal lawsuit -- were sued We settled the suit with zero -- with no admission of guilt It was very easy to do
           
           TRUMP: I notice you bring that up a lot And you know I also notice the very nasty commercials that you do on me in so many different ways which I dont do on you Maybe Im trying to save the money
           
           But frankly I look -- I look at that and I say isnt that amazing? Because I settled that lawsuit with no admission of guilt but that was a lawsuit brought against many real estate firms and its just one of those things
           
           Ill go one step further In Palm Beach Florida tough community a brilliant community a wealthy community probably the wealthiest community there is in the world I opened a club and really got great credit for it No discrimination against African- Americans against Muslims against anybody And its a tremendously successful club And Im so glad I did it And I have been given great credit for what I did And Im very very proud of it And thats the way I feel That is the true way I feel
           
           HOLT: Our next segment is called Securing America We want to start with a 21st century war happening every day in this country Our institutions are under cyber attack and our secrets are being stolen So my question is whos behind it? And how do we fight it?
           
           Secretary Clinton this answer goes to you
           
           CLINTON: Well I think cyber security cyber warfare will be one of the biggest challenges facing the next president because clearly were facing at this point two different kinds of adversaries There are the independent hacking groups that do it mostly for commercial reasons to try to steal information that they can use to make money
           
           But increasingly we are seeing cyber attacks coming from states organs of states The most recent and troubling of these has been Russia Theres no doubt now that Russia has used cyber attacks against all kinds of organizations in our country and I am deeply concerned about this I know Donalds very praiseworthy of Vladimir Putin but Putin is playing a really
           
           (CROSSTALK)
           
           CLINTON:  tough long game here And one of the things hes done is to let loose cyber attackers to hack into government files to hack into personal files hack into the Democratic National Committee And we recently have learned that you know that this is one of their preferred methods of trying to wreak havoc and collect information We need to make it very clear -- whether its Russia China Iran or anybody else -- the United States has much greater capacity And we are not going to sit idly by and permit state actors to go after our information our private-sector information or our public-sector information
           
           And were going to have to make it clear that we dont want to use the kinds of tools that we have We dont want to engage in a different kind of warfare But we will defend the citizens of this country
           
           And the Russians need to understand that I think theyve been treating it as almost a probing how far would we go how much would we do And thats why I was so -- I was so shocked when Donald publicly invited Putin to hack into Americans That is just unacceptable Its one of the reasons why 50 national security officials who served in Republican information -- in administrations
           
           HOLT: Your two minutes have expired
           
           CLINTON:  have said that Donald is unfit to be the commander- in-chief Its comments like that that really worry people who understand the threats that we face
           
           HOLT: Mr Trump you have two minutes and the same question Whos behind it? And how do we fight it?
           
           TRUMP: I do want to say that I was just endorsed -- and more are coming next week -- it will be over 200 admirals many of them here -- admirals and generals endorsed me to lead this country That just happened and many more are coming And Im very proud of it
           
           In addition I was just endorsed by ICE Theyve never endorsed anybody before on immigration I was just endorsed by ICE I was just recently endorsed -- 16500 Border Patrol agents
           
           So when Secretary Clinton talks about this I mean Ill take the admirals and Ill take the generals any day over the political hacks that I see that have led our country so brilliantly over the last 10 years with their knowledge OK? Because look at the mess that were in Look at the mess that were in
           
           As far as the cyber I agree to parts of what Secretary Clinton said We should be better than anybody else and perhaps were not I dont think anybody knows it was Russia that broke into the DNC Shes saying Russia Russia Russia but I dont -- maybe it was I mean it could be Russia but it could also be China It could also be lots of other people It also could be somebody sitting on their bed that weighs 400 pounds OK?
           
           TRUMP: You dont know who broke in to DNC
           
           But what did we learn with DNC? We learned that Bernie Sanders was taken advantage of by your people by Debbie Wasserman Schultz Look what happened to her But Bernie Sanders was taken advantage of Thats what we learned
           
           Now whether that was Russia whether that was China whether it was another country we dont know because the truth is under President Obama weve lost control of things that we used to have control over
           
           We came in with the Internet we came up with the Internet and I think Secretary Clinton and myself would agree very much when you look at what ISIS is doing with the Internet theyre beating us at our own game ISIS
           
           So we have to get very very tough on cyber and cyber warfare It is -- it is a huge problem I have a son Hes 10 years old He has computers He is so good with these computers its unbelievable The security aspect of cyber is very very tough And maybe its hardly doable
           
           But I will say we are not doing the job we should be doing But thats true throughout our whole governmental society We have so many things that we have to do better Lester and certainly cyber is one of them
           
           HOLT: Secretary Clinton?
           
           CLINTON: Well I think there are a number of issues that we should be addressing I have put forth a plan to defeat ISIS It does involve going after them online I think we need to do much more with our tech companies to prevent ISIS and their operatives from being able to use the Internet to radicalize even direct people in our country and Europe and elsewhere
           
           But we also have to intensify our air strikes against ISIS and eventually support our Arab and Kurdish partners to be able to actually take out ISIS in Raqqa end their claim of being a Caliphate
           
           Were making progress Our military is assisting in Iraq And were hoping that within the year well be able to push ISIS out of Iraq and then you know really squeeze them in Syria
           
           But we have to be cognizant of the fact that theyve had foreign fighters coming to volunteer for them foreign money foreign weapons so we have to make this the top priority
           
           And I would also do everything possible to take out their leadership I was involved in a number of efforts to take out Al Qaida leadership when I was secretary of state including of course taking out bin Laden And I think we need to go after Baghdadi as well make that one of our organizing principles Because weve got to defeat ISIS and weve got to do everything we can to disrupt their propaganda efforts online
           
           HOLT: You mention ISIS and we think of ISIS certainly as over there but there are American citizens who have been inspired to commit acts of terror on American soil the latest incident of course the bombings we just saw in New York and New Jersey the knife attack at a mall in Minnesota in the last year deadly attacks in San Bernardino and Orlando Ill ask this to both of you Tell us specifically how you would prevent homegrown attacks by American citizens Mr Trump?
           
           TRUMP: Well first I have to say one thing very important Secretary Clinton is talking about taking out ISIS We will take out ISIS Well President Obama and Secretary Clinton created a vacuum the way they got out of Iraq because they got out -- what they shouldnt have been in but once they got in the way they got out was a disaster And ISIS was formed
           
           So she talks about taking them out Shes been doing it a long time Shes been trying to take them out for a long time But they wouldnt have even been formed if they left some troops behind like 10000 or maybe something more than that And then you wouldnt have had them
           
           Or as Ive been saying for a long time and I think youll agree because I said it to you once had we taken the oil -- and we should have taken the oil -- ISIS would not have been able to form either because the oil was their primary source of income And now they have the oil all over the place including the oil -- a lot of the oil in Libya which was another one of her disasters
           
           HOLT: Secretary Clinton?
           
           CLINTON: Well I hope the fact-checkers are turning up the volume and really working hard Donald supported the invasion of Iraq
           
           TRUMP: Wrong
           
           CLINTON: That is absolutely proved over and over again
           
           TRUMP: Wrong Wrong
           
           CLINTON: He actually advocated for the actions we took in Libya and urged that Gadhafi be taken out after actually doing some business with him one time
           
           CLINTON: But the larger point -- and he says this constantly -- is George W Bush made the agreement about when American troops would leave Iraq not Barack Obama
           
           And the only way that American troops could have stayed in Iraq is to get an agreement from the then-Iraqi government that would have protected our troops and the Iraqi government would not give that
           
           But lets talk about the question you asked Lester The question you asked is what do we do here in the United States? Thats the most important part of this How do we prevent attacks? How do we protect our people?
           
           And I think weve got to have an intelligence surge where we are looking for every scrap of information I was so proud of law enforcement in New York in Minnesota in New Jersey You know they responded so quickly so professionally to the attacks that occurred by Rahami And they brought him down And we may find out more information because he is still alive which may prove to be an intelligence benefit
           
           So weve got to do everything we can to vacuum up intelligence from Europe from the Middle East That means weve got to work more closely with our allies and thats something that Donald has been very dismissive of
           
           Were working with NATO the longest military alliance in the history of the world to really turn our attention to terrorism Were working with our friends in the Middle East many of which as you know are Muslim majority nations Donald has consistently insulted Muslims abroad Muslims at home when we need to be cooperating with Muslim nations and with the American Muslim community
           
           Theyre on the front lines They can provide information to us that we might not get anywhere else They need to have close working cooperation with law enforcement in these communities not be alienated and pushed away as some of Donalds rhetoric unfortunately has led to
           
           HOLT: Mr Trump
           
           TRUMP: Well I have to respond
           
           HOLT: Please respond
           
           TRUMP: The secretary said very strongly about working with -- weve been working with them for many years and we have the greatest mess anyones ever seen You look at the Middle East its a total mess Under your direction to a large extent
           
           But you look at the Middle East you started the Iran deal thats another beauty where you have a country that was ready to fall I mean they were doing so badly They were choking on the sanctions And now theyre going to be actually probably a major power at some point pretty soon the way theyre going
           
           But when you look at NATO I was asked on a major show what do you think of NATO? And you have to understand Im a businessperson I did really well But I have common sense And I said well Ill tell you I havent given lots of thought to NATO But two things
           
           Number one the 28 countries of NATO many of them arent paying their fair share Number two -- and that bothers me because we should be asking -- were defending them and they should at least be paying us what theyre supposed to be paying by treaty and contract
           
           And number two I said and very strongly NATO could be obsolete because -- and I was very strong on this and it was actually covered very accurately in the New York Times which is unusual for the New York Times to be honest -- but I said they do not focus on terror And I was very strong And I said it numerous times
           
           And about four months ago I read on the front page of the Wall Street Journal that NATO is opening up a major terror division And I think thats great And I think we should get -- because we pay approximately 73 percent of the cost of NATO Its a lot of money to protect other people But Im all for NATO But I said they have to focus on terror also
           
           And theyre going to do that And that was -- believe me -- Im sure Im not going to get credit for it -- but that was largely because of what I was saying and my criticism of NATO
           
           I think we have to get NATO to go into the Middle East with us in addition to surrounding nations and we have to knock the hell out of ISIS and we have to do it fast when ISIS formed in this vacuum created by Barack Obama and Secretary Clinton And believe me you were the ones that took out the troops Not only that you named the day They couldnt believe it They sat back probably and said I cant believe it They said
           
           CLINTON: Lester weve covered
           
           TRUMP: No wait a minute
           
           CLINTON: Weve covered this ground
           
           TRUMP: When they formed when they formed this is something that never should have happened It should have never happened Now youre talking about taking out ISIS But you were there and you were secretary of state when it was a little infant Now its in over 30 countries And youre going to stop them? I dont think so
           
           HOLT: Mr Trump a lot of these are judgment questions You had supported the war in Iraq before the invasion What makes your
           
           TRUMP: I did not support the war in Iraq
           
           HOLT: In 2002
           
           TRUMP: That is a mainstream media nonsense put out by her because she -- frankly I think the best person in her campaign is mainstream media
           
           HOLT: My question is since you supported it
           
           TRUMP: Just -- would you like to hear
           
           HOLT:  why is your -- why is your judgment
           
           TRUMP: Wait a minute I was against the war in Iraq Just so you put it out
           
           HOLT: The record shows otherwise but why -- why was
           
           TRUMP: The record does not show that
           
           HOLT: Why was -- is your judgment any
           
           TRUMP: The record shows that Im right When I did an interview with Howard Stern very lightly first time anyones asked me that I said very lightly I dont know maybe who knows? Essentially I then did an interview with Neil Cavuto We talked about the economy is more important I then spoke to Sean Hannity which everybody refuses to call Sean Hannity I had numerous conversations with Sean Hannity at Fox And Sean Hannity said -- and he called me the other day -- and I spoke to him about it -- he said you were totally against the war because he was for the war
           
           HOLT: Why is your judgment better than
           
           TRUMP: And when he -- excuse me And that was before the war started Sean Hannity said very strongly to me and other people -- hes willing to say it but nobody wants to call him I was against the war He said you used to have fights with me because Sean was in favor of the war
           
           And I understand that side also not very much because we should have never been there But nobody called Sean Hannity And then they did an article in a major magazine shortly after the war started I think in 04 But they did an article which had me totally against the war in Iraq
           
           And one of your compatriots said you know whether it was before or right after Trump was definitely -- because if you read this article theres no doubt But if somebody -- and Ill ask the press -- if somebody would call up Sean Hannity this was before the war started He and I used to have arguments about the war I said its a terrible and a stupid thing Its going to destabilize the Middle East And thats exactly what its done Its been a disaster
           
           HOLT: My reference was to what you had said in 2002 and my question was
           
           TRUMP: No no You didnt hear what I said
           
           HOLT: Why is your judgment -- why is your judgment any different than Mrs Clintons judgment?
           
           TRUMP: Well I have much better judgment than she does Theres no question about that I also have a much better temperament than she has you know?
           
           (LAUGHTER)
           
           I have a much better -- she spent -- let me tell you -- she spent hundreds of millions of dollars on an advertising -- you know they get Madison Avenue into a room they put names -- oh temperament lets go after -- I think my strongest asset maybe by far is my temperament I have a winning temperament I know how to win She does not have a
           
           HOLT: Secretary Clinton?
           
           TRUMP: Wait The AFL-CIO the other day behind the blue screen I dont know who you were talking to Secretary Clinton but you were totally out of control I said theres a person with a temperament thats got a problem
           
           HOLT: Secretary Clinton?
           
           CLINTON: Whew OK
           
           (LAUGHTER)
           
           Lets talk about two important issues that were briefly mentioned by Donald first NATO You know NATO as a military alliance has something called Article 5 and basically it says this: An attack on one is an attack on all And you know the only time its ever been invoked? After 9/11 when the 28 nations of NATO said that they would go to Afghanistan with us to fight terrorism something that they still are doing by our side
           
           With respect to Iran when I became secretary of state Iran was weeks away from having enough nuclear material to form a bomb They had mastered the nuclear fuel cycle under the Bush administration They had built covert facilities They had stocked them with centrifuges that were whirling away
           
           And we had sanctioned them I voted for every sanction against Iran when I was in the Senate but it wasnt enough So I spent a year-and-a-half putting together a coalition that included Russia and China to impose the toughest sanctions on Iran
           
           And we did drive them to the negotiating table And my successor John Kerry and President Obama got a deal that put a lid on Irans nuclear program without firing a single shot Thats diplomacy Thats coalition-building Thats working with other nations
           
           The other day I saw Donald saying that there were some Iranian sailors on a ship in the waters off of Iran and they were taunting American sailors who were on a nearby ship He said you know if they taunted our sailors Id blow them out of the water and start another war Thats not good judgment
           
           TRUMP: That would not start a war
           
           CLINTON: That is not the right temperament to be commander-in- chief to be taunted And the worst part
           
           TRUMP: No they were taunting us
           
           CLINTON:  of what we heard Donald say has been about nuclear weapons He has said repeatedly that he didnt care if other nations got nuclear weapons Japan South Korea even Saudi Arabia It has been the policy of the United States Democrats and Republicans to do everything we could to reduce the proliferation of nuclear weapons He even said well you know if there were nuclear war in East Asia well you know thats fine
           
           TRUMP: Wrong
           
           CLINTON:  have a good time folks
           
           TRUMP: Its lies
           
           CLINTON: And in fact his cavalier attitude about nuclear weapons is so deeply troubling That is the number-one threat we face in the world And it becomes particularly threatening if terrorists ever get their hands on any nuclear material So a man who can be provoked by a tweet should not have his fingers anywhere near the nuclear codes as far as I think anyone with any sense about this should be concerned
           
           TRUMP: That lines getting a little bit old I must say I would like to
           
           CLINTON: Its a good one though It well describes the problem
           
           (LAUGHTER)
           
           TRUMP: Its not an accurate one at all Its not an accurate one So I just want to give a lot of things -- and just to respond I agree with her on one thing The single greatest problem the world has is nuclear armament nuclear weapons not global warming like you think and your -- your president thinks
           
           Nuclear is the single greatest threat Just to go down the list we defend Japan we defend Germany we defend South Korea we defend Saudi Arabia we defend countries They do not pay us But they should be paying us because we are providing tremendous service and were losing a fortune Thats why were losing -- were losing -- we lose on everything I say who makes these -- we lose on everything All I said that its very possible that if they dont pay a fair share because this isnt 40 years ago where we could do what were doing We cant defend Japan a behemoth selling us cars by the million
           
           HOLT: We need to move on
           
           TRUMP: Well wait but its very important All I said was they may have to defend themselves or they have to help us out Were a country that owes 20 trillion They have to help us out
           
           HOLT: Our last
           
           TRUMP: As far as the nuclear is concerned I agree It is the single greatest threat that this country has
           
           HOLT: Which leads to my next question as we enter our last segment here (inaudible) the subject of securing America On nuclear weapons President Obama reportedly considered changing the nations longstanding policy on first use Do you support the current policy? Mr Trump you have two minutes on that
           
           TRUMP: Well I have to say that you know for what Secretary Clinton was saying about nuclear with Russia shes very cavalier in the way she talks about various countries But Russia has been expanding their -- they have a much newer capability than we do We have not been updating from the new standpoint
           
           I looked the other night I was seeing B-52s theyre old enough that your father your grandfather could be flying them We are not -- we are not keeping up with other countries I would like everybody to end it just get rid of it But I would certainly not do first strike
           
           I think that once the nuclear alternative happens its over At the same time we have to be prepared I cant take anything off the table Because you look at some of these countries you look at North Korea were doing nothing there China should solve that problem for us China should go into North Korea China is totally powerful as it relates to North Korea
           
           And by the way another one powerful is the worst deal I think Ive ever seen negotiated that you started is the Iran deal Iran is one of their biggest trading partners Iran has power over North Korea
           
           And when they made that horrible deal with Iran they should have included the fact that they do something with respect to North Korea And they should have done something with respect to Yemen and all these other places
           
           And when asked to Secretary Kerry why didnt you do that? Why didnt you add other things into the deal? One of the great giveaways of all time of all time including 400 million in cash Nobodys ever seen that before That turned out to be wrong It was actually 17 billion in cash obviously I guess for the hostages It certainly looks that way
           
           So you say to yourself why didnt they make the right deal? This is one of the worst deals ever made by any country in history The deal with Iran will lead to nuclear problems All they have to do is sit back 10 years and they dont have to do much
           
           HOLT: Your two minutes is expired
           
           TRUMP: And theyre going to end up getting nuclear I met with Bibi Netanyahu the other day Believe me hes not a happy camper
           
           HOLT: All right Mrs Clinton Secretary Clinton you have two minutes
           
           CLINTON: Well let me -- let me start by saying words matter Words matter when you run for president And they really matter when you are president And I want to reassure our allies in Japan and South Korea and elsewhere that we have mutual defense treaties and we will honor them
           
           It is essential that Americas word be good And so I know that this campaign has caused some questioning and worries on the part of many leaders across the globe Ive talked with a number of them But I want to -- on behalf of myself and I think on behalf of a majority of the American people say that you know our word is good
           
           Its also important that we look at the entire global situation Theres no doubt that we have other problems with Iran But personally Id rather deal with the other problems having put that lid on their nuclear program than still to be facing that
           
           And Donald never tells you what he would do Would he have started a war? Would he have bombed Iran? If hes going to criticize a deal that has been very successful in giving us access to Iranian facilities that we never had before then he should tell us what his alternative would be But its like his plan to defeat ISIS He says its a secret plan but the only secret is that he has no plan
           
           So we need to be more precise in how we talk about these issues People around the word follow our presidential campaigns so closely trying to get hints about what we will do Can they rely on us? Are we going to lead the world with strength and in accordance with our values? Thats what I intend to do I intend to be a leader of our country that people can count on both here at home and around the world to make decisions that will further peace and prosperity but also stand up to bullies whether theyre abroad or at home
           
           We cannot let those who would try to destabilize the world to interfere with American interests and security
           
           HOLT: Your two minutes is
           
           CLINTON:  to be given any opportunities at all
           
           HOLT:  is expired
           
           TRUMP: Lester one thing Id like to say
           
           HOLT: Very quickly Twenty seconds
           
           TRUMP: I will go very quickly But I will tell you that Hillary will tell you to go to her website and read all about how to defeat ISIS which she could have defeated by never having it you know get going in the first place Right now its getting tougher and tougher to defeat them because theyre in more and more places more and more states more and more nations
           
           HOLT: Mr Trump
           
           TRUMP: And its a big problem And as far as Japan is concerned I want to help all of our allies but we are losing billions and billions of dollars We cannot be the policemen of the world We cannot protect countries all over the world
           
           HOLT: We have just
           
           TRUMP:  where theyre not paying us what we need
           
           HOLT: We have just a few final questions
           
           TRUMP: And she doesnt say that because shes got no business ability We need heart We need a lot of things But you have to have some basic ability And sadly she doesnt have that All of the things that shes talking about could have been taken care of during the last 10 years lets say while she had great power But they werent taken care of And if she ever wins this race they wont be taken care of
           
           HOLT: Mr Trump this year Secretary Clinton became the first woman nominated for president by a major party Earlier this month you said she doesnt have quote a presidential look Shes standing here right now What did you mean by that?
           
           TRUMP: She doesnt have the look She doesnt have the stamina I said she doesnt have the stamina And I dont believe she does have the stamina To be president of this country you need tremendous stamina
           
           HOLT: The quote was I just dont think she has the presidential look
           
           TRUMP: You have -- wait a minute Wait a minute Lester You asked me a question Did you ask me a question?
           
           You have to be able to negotiate our trade deals You have to be able to negotiate thats right with Japan with Saudi Arabia I mean can you imagine were defending Saudi Arabia? And with all of the money they have were defending them and theyre not paying? All you have to do is speak to them Wait You have so many different things you have to be able to do and I dont believe that Hillary has the stamina
           
           HOLT: Lets let her respond CLINTON: Well as soon as he travels to 112 countries and negotiates a peace deal a cease-fire a release of dissidents an opening of new opportunities in nations around the world or even spends 11 hours testifying in front of a congressional committee he can talk to me about stamina
           
           (APPLAUSE)
           
           TRUMP: The world -- let me tell you Let me tell you Hillary has experience but its bad experience We have made so many bad deals during the last -- so shes got experience that I agree
           
           (APPLAUSE)
           
           But its bad bad experience Whether its the Iran deal that youre so in love with where we gave them 150 billion back whether its the Iran deal whether its anything you can -- name -- you almost cant name a good deal I agree Shes got experience but its bad experience And this country cant afford to have another four years of that kind of experience
           
           HOLT: We are at -- we are at the final question
           
           (APPLAUSE)
           
           CLINTON: Well one thing One thing Lester
           
           HOLT: Very quickly because were at the final question now
           
           CLINTON: You know he tried to switch from looks to stamina But this is a man who has called women pigs slobs and dogs and someone who has said pregnancy is an inconvenience to employers who has said
           
           TRUMP: I never said that
           
           CLINTON:  women dont deserve equal pay unless they do as good a job as men
           
           TRUMP: I didnt say that
           
           CLINTON: And one of the worst things he said was about a woman in a beauty contest He loves beauty contests supporting them and hanging around them And he called this woman Miss Piggy Then he called her Miss Housekeeping because she was Latina Donald she has a name
           
           TRUMP: Where did you find this? Where did you find this?
           
           CLINTON: Her name is Alicia Machado
           
           TRUMP: Where did you find this?
           
           CLINTON: And she has become a US citizen and you can bet
           
           TRUMP: Oh really? CLINTON:  shes going to vote this November
           
           TRUMP: OK good Let me just tell you
           
           (APPLAUSE)
           
           HOLT: Mr Trump could we just take 10 seconds and then we ask the final question
           
           TRUMP: You know Hillary is hitting me with tremendous commercials Some of its said in entertainment Some of its said -- somebody whos been very vicious to me Rosie ODonnell I said very tough things to her and I think everybody would agree that she deserves it and nobody feels sorry for her
           
           But you want to know the truth? I was going to say something
           
           HOLT: Please very quickly
           
           TRUMP:  extremely rough to Hillary to her family and I said to myself I cant do it I just cant do it Its inappropriate Its not nice But she spent hundreds of millions of dollars on negative ads on me many of which are absolutely untrue Theyre untrue And theyre misrepresentations
           
           And I will tell you this Lester: Its not nice And I dont deserve that
           
           But its certainly not a nice thing that shes done Its hundreds of millions of ads And the only gratifying thing is I saw the polls come in today and with all of that money
           
           HOLT: We have to move on to the final question
           
           TRUMP:  200 million is spent and Im either winning or tied and Ive spent practically nothing
           
           (APPLAUSE)
           
           HOLT: One of you will not win this election So my final question to you tonight are you willing to accept the outcome as the will of the voters? Secretary Clinton?
           
           CLINTON: Well I support our democracy And sometimes you win sometimes you lose But I certainly will support the outcome of this election
           
           And I know Donalds trying very hard to plant doubts about it but I hope the people out there understand: This elections really up to you Its not about us so much as it is about you and your families and the kind of country and future you want So I sure hope you will get out and vote as though your future depended on it because I think it does
           
           HOLT: Mr Trump very quickly same question Will you accept the outcome as the will of the voters? TRUMP: I want to make America great again We are a nation that is seriously troubled Were losing our jobs People are pouring into our country
           
           The other day we were deporting 800 people And perhaps they passed the wrong button they pressed the wrong button or perhaps worse than that it was corruption but these people that we were going to deport for good reason ended up becoming citizens Ended up becoming citizens And it was 800 And now it turns out it might be 1800 and they dont even know
           
           HOLT: Will you accept the outcome of the election?
           
         
           TRUMP: Look heres the story I want to make America great again Im going to be able to do it I dont believe Hillary will The answer is if she wins I will absolutely support her
           
           (APPLAUSE)
           
           HOLT: All right Well that is going to do it for us That concludes our debate for this evening a spirit one We covered a lot of ground not everything as I suspected we would
           
           The next presidential debates are scheduled for October 9th at Washington University in St Louis and October 19th at the University of Nevada Las Vegas The conversation will continue
           
           A reminder The vice presidential debate is scheduled for October 4th at Longwood University in Farmville Virginia My thanks to Hillary Clinton and to Donald Trump and to Hofstra University for hosting us tonight Good night everyone