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January 16, 2014 04:24
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06:18 *** luxbock JOIN | |
06:18 *** TOPIC Clojure, the language http://clojure.org | | |
Currently at 1.5.1; top analysts expect this to be | |
followed by newer versions with still higher | |
numbers: | |
https://github.com/clojure/clojure/blob/master/changes.md | |
| discussion: | |
http://groups.google.com/group/clojure | Trying to | |
convince others to use Haskell is permitted between | |
0200 and 0500 UTC. (technomancy on Tue Jan 14 | |
06:12:54 2014) | |
06:18 *** NAMES @ChanServ [1]brian_ [Neurotic] _1126 _5kg _eric | |
_janne _Vi `calebmadrigal_ `cbp abaker abeaumont_ | |
aconbere actionshrimp adamhill adammh Adeon | |
adhollander AdmiralBumbleBee AeroNotix aftershave | |
ahihi AimHere aka akhudek aking akl akurilin alew | |
alexbaranosky algernon Alina-malina alindeman also | |
alxlit amackera amalloy_ ambroff_ amro andersf | |
andrewstewart anekos__ anhall_ apetresc Arafangion | |
arbscht arcatan ari` arkh arohner arrdem arubin Ash | |
aspotashev__ audaxion augustl avdi averell | |
awalters_ AWizzArd babilen bakedb balpert bass3m | |
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Biohazard birryree bitemyapp bjorkintosh | |
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brackets brainproxy brettweavnet brianwong brixen | |
Bronsa broquaint bruceadams bufferloss bunzen_ | |
bwreilly canassa cannedprimates cantsin cespare | |
charliekilo|away Chasm chavezgu chewbranca | |
ChiralSym choas ChongLi chouser_log Chousuke | |
chrisrossi chriswk ck- cldwalker___ clojurebot | |
Clome cmbntr cmn coaxmeta1 codejury codelahoma | |
coffeejunk cojennin conan ConstantineXVI | |
CookedGryphon corecode cored coventry cow-orker Cr8 | |
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eigenlicht elasticdog emacsnw_ Ember- emlyn ered | |
erewhon eric_normand Ernestas EToS Excurio expez | |
EzeQL FatsDT Fauxgrammer_ fbernier felipe` fen_ | |
fgallina fikusz firesofmay Fitzsimmons fmu foolano | |
ForNeVeR Foxboron fpk^away fractastical | |
frankgerhardt__ fuziontech gcmalloc_ gdev genehack_ | |
geoffeg geoffh gerard0 gf3 gfredericks ggherdov | |
gideonite gigetoo gilliard gko gluegadget Gooder` | |
gozala grandy gravity_ gregoriokusowski | |
gregorstocks grim_radical grncdr groot ground4 | |
gstamp guilleiguaran hakvroot_ halorgium | |
hanDerPeder hash heath Hebo helgikrs hfaafb hhenkel | |
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hsalokor hugod hyperboreean hyPiRion i_s ianeslick | |
ibdknox icedp ieure igorw ikitommi_ imkmf_ indigo | |
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janelwang_ Janiczek jarpiain jave jayne jaywatt | |
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jetlag jgmize Jii_ jjl`_ jjttjj jkj_ jleclanche | |
jlewis jlouis jml jocrau jodaro_ joegallo_ jonasac | |
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jpn jql jschairb_ JStoker jtoy jumblerg | |
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jweiss jwieringa jzelinskie Kallikrate Kallikrates | |
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KDr2 keen__ KeithPM kephale kgerman kizzx21 kliph` | |
klobucar_ kludge` kmicu Kneferilis knyon | |
knyppeldynan koalalla1a konr_ koreth_ kraft | |
kristian- kristof Kruppe ktsuji kylev_ kyrre l1x | |
l2x l3dx l4u- lancepantz_ leathekd leechbook leifw_ | |
lemonodor lenstr Leonidas leptonix lfranchi | |
Licenser llasram lluchs lmarburger lnostdal | |
lobotomy locks lokydor looper lopex lpvb lstc | |
lucian luigy lumafi lunk_ luxbock Luyt lv_ ly- m0g | |
m_3_ m_m17 mabes_ MacCoaster MacDaddy machuga | |
madscientist_ magnars maio majoh malyn Mandus | |
maravillas marsam matko matt444 matt_c matthavener | |
mattrepl mawuli mcav_ mccraig mdrogalis Mendor|s1r | |
mercwithamouth metadaddy metellus mgaare mheld | |
michaniskin microamp` Mikalv mikerod mimieux miql | |
mischanix mischov mjc mknoszlig mlb- mmitchell | |
mmullis mnemnion mocker Morgawr mpereira mrb_bk | |
mrBliss mrcheeks mrhanky mrowe msassak msgodf mtd | |
musicalchair Myk267 mysamdog n_b Natch navgeet_ | |
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noidi noncom noonian noplamodo normanrichards | |
nseger nuclearsandwich nullman numberten octe | |
Oddman Odin- Odinodin ohcibi OlegYch omarkj | |
onthestairs ontoillogical opqdonut ordnungswidrig | |
orkaa ormiret Orva oubiwann ozzloy patchwork | |
patrickod paulweb515 pcarrier pcn pdurbin | |
pel_daniel pepijndevos peregrin_ peregrine81 | |
petehunt peterdon pisketti pjstadig poggio poikon_ | |
pradeepc prip Profpatsch progo pyrtsa pyykkis qrada | |
quizdr qz racycle radix raek rafl Ragnor rainbyte | |
raiskaillaan ranek raoul rasmusto Raynes Raynos | |
rbanffy rbolkey rboyd_ rdd redinger reeses | |
reiddraper replicant retzkek rgrinberg rhg135 rhoml | |
riley526 rippy rjknight rkneufeld rlb rlr robink_ | |
rotty_ rovar rowth_ rplaca rs0 rsenior rtl ruff | |
rufoa runningskull rurumate1 rxe3 ryanf | |
ryanflorence ryland_ s4muel saiam samflores_ | |
saolsen saurik_ scape scgilardi schmir schwap_ | |
scizo Scorchin scottj scttnlsn seancorfield | |
seangrove sebastianb sebber SegFaultAX septomin | |
sethalves seubert sghai_afk shadower Shambles_ | |
shaungilchrist shep-home shep-werk shiney shira | |
shiranaihito SHODAN shoky si14 silven simcop2387 | |
sinemetu1 sjl Slackwise slpsys sluukkonen smiler | |
snikkers so sobel socksy solussd sorabji5252 | |
Sorella_ sorenmacbeth SparkySparkyBoom SpiderByte | |
spjt splunk srcerer sritchie sross07 ssedano | |
ssfrr_afk stain statonjr steerio stevenfx sturner | |
subbyyy_ sundbp sw1nn swart sxn synfinatic TakeV | |
talios tbaldrid_ tcrawley-away tcrayford | |
technomancy Ted telex tephra terjesb terom | |
teslanick1 testclo TEttinger TEttinger2 tfnico | |
ThaDon the-kenny TheBusby TheMoonMaster_ | |
ThePawnBreak thorstadt ticking TimMc tmarble tobyp | |
Tolstoy tomaw tomhs_ tomjoro tomku tos9 ToxicFrog | |
tpatja_ tpope Tristam TristamWrk troezen Tuna-Fish | |
turtil twem2 Uatec ucb unsymbol uris77_ uruviel_ | |
ustunozgur vdm VFe_ Viesti vili vilmibm vixns | |
vizant0 voldyman vsync waf wafflepilot wdouglas` | |
wedr whee whilo_ whoahbot whr Wild_Cat wilfredh | |
willb wink wjlroe wkelly wolfes wolfes1 wormphlegm | |
wunki WWWest1 xeqi xian xnil Xorlev xuser yacin_ | |
Yamazaki-kun yarou yazirian yedi yeshuah | |
yogthos|away yumike zaiste zakwilson zaphar_p1 | |
Zariel zby_ zenoli zeroem zerokarmaleft zerowidth | |
zeroz_ zilti zmansiv zoldar ztellman zz_anildigital | |
zz_karupanerura | |
06:18 <***> Buffer Playback... | |
06:18 <xuser> 06:08 bitemyapp: yes | |
06:18 <bitemyapp> 06:08 xuser: if you use something named "dev" in | |
production you deserve what'll come to you. | |
06:18 <bitemyapp> 06:08 xuser: it's H2. | |
06:18 <bitemyapp> 06:08 you do not...want to use H2 in | |
production-anything. | |
06:18 <jjl`_> 06:08 to be fair, it refers to it as 'transactor | |
local', as opposed to 'dev' | |
06:18 <bitemyapp> 06:09 jjl`_: the config file says "dev" | |
06:18 <bitemyapp> 06:09 when people ask questions, I check my code, | |
not their godforsaken website. | |
06:18 <bitemyapp> 06:09 their documentation has not historically | |
helped us much. | |
06:18 <jjl`_> 06:09 :) | |
06:18 <bitemyapp> 06:09 working code and pestering them via support | |
went much further. | |
06:18 <technomancy> 06:10 sritchie: I think it might have been a | |
workaround for a bug in older lein versions; is | |
it still around? | |
06:18 <sritchie> 06:10 just showed up on heroku | |
06:18 <technomancy> 06:10 sritchie: on a recently-deployed app? | |
06:18 <sritchie> 06:10 yeah, just a minute ago | |
06:18 <sritchie> 06:11 technomancy: I had to do some really funky | |
build stuff to get around these issues with Austin | |
destroying my AOT compilation... | |
06:18 <technomancy> 06:11 ok, means I forgot to do some cleanup is | |
all | |
06:18 <sritchie> 06:11 so, liberal use of ^:replace | |
06:18 <technomancy> 06:11 should be able to safely ignore it | |
06:18 <sritchie> 06:12 okay, cool | |
06:18 <matt444> 06:13 If you right a function that uses chans | |
internally, does a function that uses it need to | |
know that chans are being used, need to use any | |
special syntax? | |
06:18 <matt444> 06:13 They have to use take!, right? | |
06:18 <matt444> 06:16 or no, you use <! | |
06:18 <***> Playback Complete. | |
06:18 *** scalabl3 JOIN | |
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06:19 *** Sorella_ NICK Sorella | |
06:19 <shaungilchrist> like function that returns a chan you mean? | |
06:21 <xuser> bitemyapp: you are worried about aws lock-in but not | |
datomic lock-in? | |
06:21 <scape> :) | |
06:22 *** lemonodor QUIT Quit: lemonodor | |
06:22 *** subbyyy_ QUIT Ping timeout: 248 seconds | |
06:22 [technomancy hands xuser a copy of who_we_hate_today.csv] | |
06:22 <technomancy> see, no datomic | |
06:22 <scape> lol | |
06:22 <technomancy> carry on; nothing to see here =) | |
06:23 *** nlew_ JOIN | |
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06:24 *** mrevil JOIN | |
06:24 <justin_smith> regarding aws lockin, who good an option is | |
openstack, and how hard is it to target | |
openstack as an aws replacement? | |
06:24 *** piranha JOIN | |
06:24 *** mrcheeks QUIT Quit: ERC Version 5.3 (IRC client for | |
Emacs) | |
06:24 <alew> I heard openstack isn't doing so well | |
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06:25 *** zby JOIN | |
06:25 <scape> I was rather happy with Linode, AWS pricing fluxuates | |
too easily | |
06:25 *** mabes_ QUIT Remote host closed the connection | |
06:25 <nDuff> justin_smith: *shrug*. Depends on how much AWS | |
infrastructure you're using. | |
06:25 *** Joreji QUIT Remote host closed the connection | |
06:26 <nDuff> justin_smith: ...Amazon is certainly adding new APIs | |
faster than they're being implemented elsewhere. | |
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06:30 <luxbock> I'm trying to solve Project Euler problem 3 without | |
looking at other peoples solutions and I'm stuck | |
06:30 <luxbock> https://gist.github.com/8446851 | |
06:30 *** kliph` QUIT Ping timeout: 265 seconds | |
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06:30 *** pdk JOIN | |
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06:30 *** sinemetu1 NICK sgarrett|afk | |
06:30 <luxbock> the number presented in the problem is so large | |
that it jams my repl | |
06:30 *** tcrawley-away NICK tcrawley | |
06:31 *** thenovices QUIT Ping timeout: 246 seconds | |
06:31 *** gws JOIN | |
06:31 <bitemyapp> xuser: I'm pretty grumpy about the fact that it's | |
not open source. | |
06:31 <bitemyapp> xuser: but I don't have a great alternative at | |
the moment for a historical database. | |
06:31 <arrdem> luxbock: you can write a better primality test than | |
that... | |
06:31 <arrdem> luxbock: also memoization would be nice here | |
06:32 <hyPiRion> luxbock: remember that factors are not the same as | |
prime factors | |
06:32 *** egosum QUIT Remote host closed the connection | |
06:32 <luxbock> ah, what algorithm should I be using? I got this | |
one from SO | |
06:32 <arrdem> luxbock: this is good, you can just tune it some | |
06:32 <luxbock> oh yeah the factors function isn't really used for | |
anything | |
06:32 <arrdem> luxbock: also hyPiRion hit this nail on the head | |
06:32 *** ranek JOIN | |
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06:33 *** TheMoonMaster_ NICK TheMoonMaster | |
06:33 <arrdem> luxbock: really what you want to do is build a cache | |
of {a | (prime? a) && (zero? (n % a))} | |
06:33 <luxbock> I had it there from an earlier attempt that was | |
doomed to fail | |
06:33 <arrdem> luxbock: which is trivial if you just compute all | |
prime factors up to (sqrt n) | |
06:34 <arrdem> sorry. just primes. no factor requirement. | |
06:34 *** tmciver JOIN | |
06:34 <arrdem> then the largest n \in that set is your largest | |
prime factor | |
06:34 *** kalloc QUIT Ping timeout: 248 seconds | |
06:34 *** riotonthebay JOIN | |
06:34 <luxbock> alright, I'll check out memoize as well | |
06:35 <arrdem> luxbock: memoize is really gonna help if you do this | |
counting up thing. | |
06:35 <luxbock> but shouldn't the way I was doing it be even | |
faster? although I now realize that starting at | |
half of n is far too high | |
06:35 *** mmitchell QUIT Quit: Leaving... | |
06:35 [arrdem wishes he could just hack on Project Euler rather | |
than do coursework] | |
06:35 <luxbock> do I really have to calculate all the primes | |
between 2 to n, when I only need the highest? | |
06:36 <arrdem> luxbock: not [8,n), [8,(sqrt n)] | |
06:36 <arrdem> well... I guess it's really [4,sqrt(n)] | |
06:37 *** teslanick1 QUIT Quit: Leaving. | |
06:37 <hyPiRion> luxbock: it's sufficient to calculate up to | |
sqrt(n), if you divide the number with the primes | |
you've found so far | |
06:37 <arrdem> the point is that if you count _up_ you have this | |
O(1) primality table lookup from memoize on your | |
side. | |
06:38 *** sgarrett|afk NICK sinemetu1 | |
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06:38 <luxbock> ah, so I should be counting up and not down | |
06:38 *** mabes JOIN | |
06:38 <arrdem> luxbock: yes, and the table of known primes is | |
crucial to doing this really fast. | |
06:39 *** nighty^ JOIN | |
06:39 <arrdem> luxbock: retaining a table known primes will be much | |
more efficient than memoizing the entire prime? | |
function. | |
06:40 *** cgag JOIN | |
06:41 <hyPiRion> It's not that critical for this one, actually. | |
06:41 <luxbock> so what would be a better test for primality? | |
06:41 <luxbock> http://en.literateprograms.org/Miller-Rabin_primality_test_%28Clojure%29 | |
06:41 <luxbock> I found this but it seems like an overkill | |
06:42 <hyPiRion> luxbock: the primality test you already got is | |
sufficient for this problem | |
06:42 <luxbock> ok | |
06:42 *** tupi JOIN | |
06:43 <hyPiRion> (Shameless self-plug: If you need a more | |
performant one later, | |
https://github.com/hyPiRion/primes is pretty fast | |
and is thread-safe) | |
06:43 *** ChiralSym QUIT Read error: Connection reset by peer | |
06:44 *** ChiralSym JOIN | |
06:44 <luxbock> cool | |
06:44 *** juxovec JOIN | |
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ZZZzzz… | |
06:46 *** und3rt JOIN | |
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06:48 <koreth_> For what it's worth, I found 4clojure and | |
exercism.io to be better Clojure learning tools | |
than Project Euler. PE is great for testing your | |
computational mathematics skills but its problems | |
are mostly pretty far removed from anything you'd | |
actually do in real life (well, unless you are a | |
mathematician!) | |
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06:49 *** rsenior JOIN | |
06:49 <luxbock> yeah I know, I'm kind of learning how to use | |
simple-check at the same time | |
06:49 *** juxovec QUIT Ping timeout: 252 seconds | |
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06:49 <hyPiRion> luxbock: In this case, it's sufficient to find the | |
prime numbers below sqrt(n) dividing n. That can | |
be done through `(filter (fn [num] (and (prime? | |
num) (divides? n num))) (range (Math/sqrt n)))` | |
06:49 *** cemerick JOIN | |
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06:50 <luxbock> oh duh, and here I was writing a loop | |
06:50 *** masondesu JOIN | |
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06:52 <hyPiRion> it's one of the things which comes with training | |
in functional languages | |
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06:52 *** ne-on JOIN | |
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06:53 <luxbock> I think that's how I would usually write it, but I | |
had this idea in my head that loops are more | |
efficient | |
06:54 <bitemyapp> luxbock: why? | |
06:54 *** zbyte64 JOIN | |
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06:54 <luxbock> from reading Mikera's posts on core.matrix, but | |
that level of optimization is far above my skill | |
level | |
06:54 <bitemyapp> luxbock: some of that might have more to do with | |
the limitations of Clojure than anything | |
involving FP. | |
06:55 *** kanja QUIT Ping timeout: 272 seconds | |
06:55 <bitemyapp> luxbock: there are languages that do things like | |
loop and stream fusion of higher order functions | |
like fold. | |
06:55 *** masondesu QUIT Ping timeout: 246 seconds | |
06:55 <luxbock> actually the other purpose for playing with project | |
Euler problems for me was to do micro benchmarks | |
with criterium for different approaches | |
06:55 *** awalters_ QUIT Ping timeout: 276 seconds | |
06:55 *** lstc QUIT | |
06:55 <luxbock> yeah I don't doubt that at all | |
06:56 <luxbock> for me compilers are pure black box magic though | |
06:56 *** solussd QUIT Quit: solussd | |
06:56 <luxbock> so I go by bits and pieces of what I read here and | |
there | |
06:56 *** SparkySparkyBoom QUIT Quit: Leaving | |
06:57 <zbyte64> Anyone know how to write an om component (reactjs) | |
that returns a string as html? (the string is | |
generated by a 3rd party js library) | |
06:57 *** kanja JOIN | |
06:57 <luxbock> but this is actually exactly what I wanted to do.. | |
I'll write the loop version next and then compare | |
them | |
06:57 <zbyte64> returning a function or a string creates an | |
invariant exception | |
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ZZZzzz… | |
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07:23 <alew> are there any good instrumentation solutions for | |
clojure ala new relic? | |
07:23 <technomancy> new relic works with clojure | |
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07:24 <alew> not automatically | |
07:24 <alew> you have to provide annotations | |
07:25 <technomancy> it does a bunch of stuff without annotations | |
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07:25 <technomancy> maybe with annotations it does more though | |
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07:26 <alew> Throwing it up on heroku with just the default setup | |
only shows me memory usage, nothing else | |
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07:26 <technomancy> hm; I have seen it do a pretty thorough | |
profiling without changing any source | |
07:26 <technomancy> this was 2 years ago though | |
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07:26 <alew> apparently one of the versions they released had | |
accidently support for ring instrumentation | |
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07:27 <quizdr> is there a practical limit to the number of args you | |
can send to apply? in common lisp, this limit can be | |
very low dependent on the implementation | |
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07:29 <rasmusto> quizdr: there's a limit to the number of arguments | |
that a fn can take, but you can do [blah & more] | |
to get the rest | |
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07:29 <nDuff> quizdr: in general, Clojure falls back to being | |
inefficient if you're using a really large number, as | |
opposed to just not working. | |
07:30 <nDuff> (err, number of args) | |
07:30 <cgag> https://github.com/clojure/clojure/blob/master/src/clj/clojure/core.clj#L612 | |
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07:30 <cgag> if you're curious | |
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07:31 <nDuff> quizdr: ...though there _are_ some fairly low limits | |
on how many args a function can take if you're using | |
primitive data types. | |
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07:31 <quizdr> ok, i was reading about how some functions use apply | |
in their implementation, such as join. | |
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07:32 <nDuff> quizdr: *nod*. In general, that'll fall back to an | |
implementation that passes an Object[] as the last | |
argument (which is how Java's varargs work in | |
general), and can thus handle an arbitrary length. | |
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07:43 <lsdafjklsd> Anyone using lightable to develop clojurescript | |
apps and know how to hook up a browser repl? | |
07:43 <john2x> anybody using revise? I was wondering on what's the | |
standard way of creating the database and tables.. | |
would an arbitrary "script" (that's not part of the | |
main project's namespace?) that creates it suffice? | |
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07:48 <technomancy> clojurebot: clojars migrations? | |
07:48 <clojurebot> Cool story bro. | |
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07:48 <technomancy> aw come on | |
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07:48 <technomancy> I know I've taught you that before | |
07:48 <matt444> What is the difference between a chan and port? | |
07:48 <matt444> Seem to the same | |
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07:49 <technomancy> clojurebot: clojars migrations |are| just a | |
namespace with functions: | |
https://github.com/ato/clojars-web/blob/master/src/clojars/db/migrate.clj | |
07:49 <clojurebot> Ack. Ack. | |
07:49 <technomancy> john2x: ^ check that out | |
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07:56 <lsdafjklsd> clojurebot: clojars migrations? | |
07:56 <clojurebot> clojars migrations are just a namespace with | |
functions: | |
https://github.com/ato/clojars-web/blob/master/src/clojars/db/migrate.clj | |
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08:13 <arrdem> technomancy: does clojurebot not provide inference | |
engine responses to arbitrary channel text? | |
08:13 <arrdem> I'm looking at the inference engine and it doesn't | |
look like arbitrary patterns can be matched... | |
08:14 <technomancy> arrdem: I feel like if I dove into the source | |
it would take away the mystery | |
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08:15 <technomancy> arrdem: that said I think for every line | |
there's a 1% chance he'll interpret it as being | |
addressed to him | |
08:15 <arohner> when parsing some XML w/ clojure.data.xml, I'm | |
hitting https://gist.github.com/arohner/8448042 I | |
think it has something to do w/ XML namespaces? | |
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08:16 <technomancy> "Namespaces? But XML doesn't have namespaces." | |
--every XML library author, at first | |
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08:16 <arohner> :-) | |
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08:17 <arrdem> technomancy: ok. I was kinda looking for a way to | |
make clojurebot match "*.pastebin*." | |
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08:24 <squidz> is there a good way to profile clojurescript | |
performance? | |
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08:26 <bbloom> squidz: w/ source maps, standard js profilign tools | |
apply | |
08:26 <squidz> bbloom: okay thanks | |
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08:33 <davorb> hey. i'm new to clojure, but i've used common lisp | |
before. can i use slime with clojure or something | |
similar? | |
08:33 <jack_rabbit> nrepl | |
08:34 <jack_rabbit> davorb, it's about the same. | |
08:34 <davorb> thanks jack_rabbit | |
08:34 <jack_rabbit> np :) | |
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08:35 <AimHere> davorb, there IS clojure slime. But everyone | |
stopped using it when they discovered nrepl | |
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08:37 <davorb> and can someone explain to me what leiningen is? is | |
it like ruby gems or is it like javascript's yeoman? | |
08:37 <davorb> or is it sort of like grunt? | |
08:37 <davorb> i've looked at it, and it feels like you've got a | |
bunch of grunt tasks and then you run them | |
08:37 <bja> davorb, sorta like grunt. it's a nicer interface to | |
maven | |
08:38 <davorb> ah, okay. so it's basically a build manager? | |
08:38 <bja> yes, but it has a lot of development-related | |
functionality too | |
08:38 <AimHere> Something like that. Basically if you're doing | |
anything in clojure, you want it, and you want it | |
bad | |
08:38 <bja> AimHere, if you do stuff in other languages you want it | |
and want it bad too. | |
08:39 <bja> want to kill myself when I use pip/virtualenv | |
08:39 <AimHere> It's clojure's swiss-army build tool | |
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08:40 <bitemyapp> davorb: Clojure is just a library. | |
08:40 <bitemyapp> davorb: Leiningen and nrepl are your interfaces | |
to the language-that-is-a-library | |
08:40 <davorb> bitemyapp: okay, i think i get it. thanks. | |
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08:49 <chare> ok bad news | |
08:49 <chare> I had discussion with friends | |
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08:49 <chare> they want ruby on rails | |
08:49 <chare> tell me that clojure has something I can counter with | |
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08:50 <cgag> that's a hard battle to win | |
08:50 <locks> there’s pedestal… | |
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08:51 <cgag> immutability by default, much better performance, | |
actual concurrency support | |
08:51 <bitemyapp> guys | |
08:51 <bitemyapp> don't waste your time on this person. | |
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08:52 <locks> that’s harsh | |
08:52 <bitemyapp> He's a troll or at minimum not quite | |
psychotypical. | |
08:52 <bitemyapp> locks: he's been trolling this channel since last | |
year. | |
08:52 <AimHere> Nothing wrong with a little light trolling | |
08:52 <bitemyapp> locks: he's the whole reason we had to bring | |
active ops back. | |
08:52 <bitemyapp> single-handedly. | |
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08:52 <AimHere> Especially since all it'll get him is a salespitch | |
for clojure! | |
08:52 <locks> maybe he just needs love | |
08:52 <bitemyapp> I'm not exaggerating. | |
08:52 <bitemyapp> locks: we uh, tried that. He never stops language | |
trolling. Ever. | |
08:52 <bitemyapp> locks: months and months on end. | |
08:52 <bitemyapp> Please stop polluting the channel with this. | |
08:53 <bitemyapp> If you really want to help him, have him query | |
you. | |
08:53 <chare> bitemyapp why dho you hate me | |
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08:53 <bitemyapp> chare: you don't code. | |
08:53 <bitemyapp> chare: you waste the time of people that do. | |
08:53 <chare> you are overexaggerating | |
08:53 <chare> and what is pedestal | |
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08:54 <bitemyapp> you don't need to prefix 'exaggerating' with | |
'over'. | |
08:54 <bitemyapp> Exaggeration is exaggeration. Overexaggeration is | |
redundant. | |
08:54 <bitemyapp> And I'm not exaggerating. | |
08:54 <locks> chare: pedestal is a web framework for clojure, it is | |
very similar to ruby on rails | |
08:54 <AimHere> overexaggerating is a pretty good self-referential | |
term. | |
08:54 <chare> how similar is similiar | |
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08:55 <rkneufeld> locks: wut | |
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08:56 <bja> chare, they are both web frameworks | |
08:56 [bitemyapp snorts and laughs] | |
08:56 <locks> chare: they both show HTML in your browser | |
08:56 <bitemyapp> rkneufeld: but the real question is, do you | |
*really* want to dive in? | |
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08:57 <bitemyapp> locks: I don't think you've used Pedestal mate. | |
It's quite nice, but I don't think I'd call it | |
similar, let alone 'very', to Rails at all. It's | |
the closest thing Clojure has to a fully | |
integrated web stack though, which is possibly | |
desirable if you don't like more componentized | |
approaches like Ring/Compojure/et al. | |
08:57 <quizdr> i'm a little confused by the arguments list that | |
starts out this function, is it a destructing form? | |
(fn primes-from [n [f & r]] ..... | |
08:58 <bitemyapp> locks: there's a big emphasis in Pedestal on | |
things that Rails, frankly, can't even do at all. | |
08:58 <bja> bitemyapp, caribou looks framework-ish | |
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08:58 <locks> bitemyapp: I was suppose to counter-troll him, not | |
troll you | |
08:58 <bja> I haven't seen any other frameworks that are being | |
maintained | |
08:59 <arrdem> why isn't /ignore working on chare... | |
08:59 <bja> unless you count immutant | |
08:59 <locks> I was about to say datomic is a clojure library for | |
mysql but, well | |
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08:59 <bitemyapp> locks: this isn't trolling and you're propagating | |
inaccurate information in a public channel and | |
adding to the pollution. Just stop. | |
08:59 <AimHere> quizdr, yes, that's what it seems to do | |
08:59 <bitemyapp> bja: Luminus is what I usually recommend to | |
people that want a shake-n-bake way to get | |
started. | |
08:59 <luxbock> there's also http://hoplon.io/ | |
09:00 <bitemyapp> bja: Caribou is half-way point between the | |
template-y Luminus and the framework approach. | |
09:00 <bitemyapp> this is information that could go on the | |
wiki....hmmm. | |
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09:00 <chare> what are these supposed things that pedestal can do | |
but rails can't | |
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09:02 <bitemyapp> chare: learn to google, wastrel. | |
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09:03 <chare> bitemyapp: you're the expert so I defer to your | |
expertise | |
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09:04 <bitemyapp> chare: I want some evidence that you're going to | |
stop wasting peoples' time and start writing code | |
before I lift a finger on your behalf. You've | |
wasted countless hours already. | |
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09:04 <kristof> "If you don't like componentized appraoches like | |
Ring/Compojure/et al" | |
09:04 <bitemyapp> kristof: what? | |
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09:05 <kristof> You know, once I read somewhere that component mix | |
and match web development was "the Clojure Way". I | |
think that was someone justifying the lack of a | |
full web stack floating around. | |
09:05 <seubert> it used to be a fuller web stack, this is | |
intentional | |
09:05 <quizdr> if I want a function to accept a vector as an | |
argument, I must use & to access all the elements in | |
the vector, right? Because just binding the whole | |
vector to a single argument variable doesn't seem to | |
do this: (defn gsg [j [r]] [ j r]) returns (gsg 1 | |
[2 4 5 6]) --> [1 2] | |
09:05 <kristof> Probably. | |
09:05 <bitemyapp> seubert: not fuller, just more integrated. | |
09:05 <arrdem> bitemyapp: if one was so inclined you could probably | |
compute the average response time per word of | |
#clojure, count the number of words ever sent to | |
chare/chord and then compute the USD price of wasted | |
developer time... | |
09:05 <kristof> What's the equivalent of Rack for Clojure? | |
09:05 <seubert> right, sorry bitemyapp | |
09:05 <bitemyapp> kristof: we atomized Noir on purpose. | |
09:05 <cgag> quizdr: yeah, looks like that takes a number and a | |
seq, and binds the first element of that seq to f and | |
the rest of it to r | |
09:05 <ddellacosta> kristof: ring | |
09:05 <cgag> oh wow | |
09:05 <cgag> woops | |
09:06 <kristof> Oh, that's right | |
09:06 <bitemyapp> kristof: in Haskell that'd be WAI. | |
09:06 <bitemyapp> arrdem: tempting. | |
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09:06 <kristof> Yes, I remember reading about WAI | |
09:06 <bitemyapp> arrdem: I should invoice the motherfucker. | |
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09:06 <bitemyapp> arrdem: and put up a trust fund for learning | |
Clojure developers that disburses money for | |
books. | |
09:06 <bitemyapp> books* | |
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09:06 <bitemyapp> you only get reimbursed if you actually read the | |
book. | |
09:07 <chare> bitemyapp: if we want clojure to beat ruby then we | |
need you to be working on the nextgen framework for | |
clojure | |
09:07 <kristof> bitemyapp: the funds would go directly to No Starch | |
Press | |
09:07 <arrdem> kristof: I find this outcome acceptable | |
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09:08 <bitemyapp> kristof: LYAH? | |
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09:08 <kristof> chare: I believe he just said not 3 minutes "start | |
writing code before I lift a finger on your behalf" | |
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09:08 <kristof> bitemyapp: I wasn't aware that NSP was the one that | |
published the LYAH book | |
09:08 <locks> my LYAH book arrived with the spine unglued :( | |
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09:09 <locks> hazards of mail | |
09:09 <kristof> locks: less starch that way | |
09:09 <bitemyapp> locks: yeowch. | |
09:09 <bja> chare, I don't know that anyone is looking to beat ruby | |
09:09 <bitemyapp> kristof: LYSE too. | |
09:09 <bitemyapp> chare: I don't write that much Clojure outside of | |
work anymore. | |
09:09 <kristof> Learn You Some Erlang? | |
09:09 *** jcromartie JOIN | |
09:09 <bitemyapp> kristof: yis. | |
09:10 <locks> I re-started reading joy of clojure 2ed today | |
09:10 <bitemyapp> locks: still MEAP? | |
09:10 *** rfarrjr QUIT Remote host closed the connection | |
09:10 <locks> bitemyapp: yup | |
09:10 <locks> think so | |
09:10 *** john2x QUIT Read error: Operation timed out | |
09:10 <kristof> Did they push the release date on that one? | |
09:10 *** rfarrjr JOIN | |
09:10 <quizdr> ah i figured out my brain fry on the destructing | |
thanks cgag and AimHere | |
09:10 <bitemyapp> I think I'm already on that. Saw an email update | |
about it. | |
09:11 <locks> last update was somewhere last week | |
09:11 <chare> why is there no learn you a clojure book | |
09:11 *** EzeQL JOIN | |
09:11 <locks> kristof: "Expected publication Winter 2014" | |
09:11 *** jimduey JOIN | |
09:11 <kristof> locks: Guess I was thinking about something else. | |
09:11 *** und3rt QUIT Quit: Colloquy for iPhone - | |
http://colloquy.mobi | |
09:12 <ddellacosta> chare: Clojure Programming works for that | |
(http://www.clojurebook.com/) | |
09:12 <bitemyapp> ddellacosta: and then some. | |
09:12 *** jackdanger JOIN | |
09:12 <chare> ddellacosta: not paying | |
09:12 <quizdr> chard a new book on Web development in Clojure was | |
just released today | |
09:13 <quizdr> i meant chare not chard | |
09:13 <bitemyapp> whatever, that's been one of his names too. | |
09:13 <quizdr> ha ha | |
09:13 *** s4muel QUIT Quit: ZNC - http://znc.in | |
09:14 <ddellacosta> chare: if you need free resources to learn | |
Clojure, you can start the way I did, with | |
4clojure and the Clojure core API reference. | |
That combined with stack overflow and asking | |
meaningful questions on IRC is a great way to | |
learn. | |
09:14 <locks> http://en.wikibooks.org/wiki/Clojure_Programming | |
09:14 <locks> clojurescriptkoans.com | |
09:14 <locks> etc | |
09:14 <ddellacosta> locks: yeah, great links | |
09:14 <ddellacosta> forgot about clojurescriptkoans | |
09:15 <locks> the koans aren’t for everyone | |
09:15 *** s4muel JOIN | |
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09:16 <quizdr> wait did chare say there is no clojure book out | |
there? by last count there are at least 8 or 9 solid | |
Clojure books in publication | |
09:16 *** Blackavar JOIN | |
09:17 <chare> FREE BOK | |
09:17 <quizdr> chard did you ever go to the cinema? | |
09:17 <quizdr> chare | |
09:17 <quizdr> do you go to the cinema ever, or sometimes stop for | |
a meal at a restaurant? | |
09:17 <arrdem> bitemyapp: so this dropbox thing worked out pretty | |
well... | |
09:18 *** jweiss QUIT Ping timeout: 272 seconds | |
09:18 <arrdem> bitemyapp: now I have ~/doc/org/* sync magically | |
across mobile, laptop and desktop :D | |
09:18 <xuser> chare: http://www.braveclojure.com/ | |
09:18 *** darthdeus JOIN | |
09:18 <ddellacosta> chare, are you finding any of these links | |
useful to you? | |
09:18 <bitemyapp> arrdem: eggscellent :) | |
09:19 <chare> ddellacosta: I haven't started yet still reading | |
erlang book | |
09:19 <ddellacosta> chare: your point? | |
09:19 <luxbock> arrdem: are you using MobileOrg? | |
09:20 *** gja JOIN | |
09:20 <`cbp> clojure cookbook is free | |
09:21 *** TEttinger QUIT Ping timeout: 246 seconds | |
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09:23 *** cgag QUIT Quit: Leaving | |
09:23 <quizdr> there are some great links here, interesting books | |
i've never heard of and that are free, sweet, thanks | |
guys. chare hope you are paying attention. | |
09:24 *** gja QUIT Client Quit | |
09:24 <jcromartie> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XluovrUA6Bk | |
09:24 *** chronno JOIN | |
09:24 <ddellacosta> quizdr: glad someone is getting something out | |
of it. :-) | |
09:25 *** thenovices JOIN | |
09:25 <chare> so clojure needs to kill ruby and python thats all I | |
care about eventually | |
09:25 <ddellacosta> jcromartie: I think he's holding a copy of "The | |
Internet Gazette" at the top, excellent | |
09:26 *** bbloom JOIN | |
09:26 *** jumblerg QUIT Quit: My MacBook Pro has gone to sleep. | |
ZZZzzz… | |
09:26 *** tbaldridge JOIN | |
09:26 <ddellacosta> chare: alright, I tried to give you the benefit | |
of the doubt. I wish you adieu and good luck. | |
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09:26 <quizdr> my first clojure book was the OReilly book. it was a | |
bit intimidating for someone totally new to this | |
kind of programming, let alone the language. after | |
150 pages, i switched to Halloway's book, much more | |
accessible to a newcomer | |
09:26 *** David JOIN | |
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09:27 <quizdr> i look forward to the OReilly book after I have a | |
few thousand lines of Clojure under my belt | |
09:27 *** darthdeus JOIN | |
09:27 <chare> ddellacosta admit it you want python and ruby to die | |
too | |
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09:29 <kristof> chare: Such a hard stance. You fighter! Why do you | |
feel this way? | |
09:29 *** thenovices QUIT Ping timeout: 245 seconds | |
09:30 <chare> kristof I'm just saying what I think not hiding the | |
politically incorrect view that you're afraid to say | |
09:30 <quizdr> no kidding. his thinking is very black and white. in | |
his defense, this is a typical perception for many | |
with a programmer's mind. but those who appreciate | |
the grey areas will get more out of programming, and | |
of life. i think clojure was created with such | |
perception | |
09:30 *** DrNex JOIN | |
09:30 <kristof> chare: You remind me of Napoleon "liberating" | |
Europe. | |
09:30 *** ianeslick QUIT Ping timeout: 272 seconds | |
09:30 *** piranha QUIT Read error: Operation timed out | |
09:31 <kristof> Anyway, I am too busy enjoying my life to embark on | |
a crusade. | |
09:31 <chare> quizdr why do you fight the urges to say you hate | |
python and ruby | |
09:31 *** bbloom QUIT Ping timeout: 245 seconds | |
09:31 <quizdr> chard no one here is "afraid" to say "python must | |
die." why do you think that? who wants them to | |
"die"? who has the energy to waste on such nonsense? | |
you are a troll man. | |
09:31 *** gregoriokusows-1 QUIT Quit: gregoriokusows-1 | |
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09:32 *** amalloy_ NICK amalloy | |
09:32 <ddellacosta> now that we've established that, let us let the | |
troll starve and encourage it to move on to | |
seek more bountiful pastures | |
09:33 <quizdr> ddellacosta agreed my brother | |
09:33 <ddellacosta> quizdr: :-) | |
09:33 *** doomlord_ JOIN | |
09:34 <quizdr> i'm going to go get some biryani now and satisfy my | |
taste buds with some spicy curry | |
09:34 <kristof> Oh! You lucky duck. | |
09:34 *** jfc JOIN | |
09:34 <quizdr> i'd say you should join me but i suspect that's not | |
practical or likely. | |
09:34 *** kalloc QUIT Ping timeout: 276 seconds | |
09:34 <kristof> I will travel the world over for spicy foods. | |
09:35 <quizdr> as do i | |
09:35 *** tomjoro JOIN | |
09:35 <kristof> Oh, that's actually a good idea. I wonder if my | |
girlfriend would go for that... | |
09:35 <matt444> Any hint at what I'm doing wrong here? | |
https://www.refheap.com/24088 | |
09:35 <quizdr> anyone else in here from Singapore? | |
09:35 <arrdem> luxbock: yep :D | |
09:35 <arrdem> luxbock: haven't used it for anything yet but I just | |
got the import/export crud set up. | |
09:35 *** ticking QUIT | |
09:36 <quizdr> there's a big Haskell group here in Singapore but | |
I'd love to get some Clojure meet ups going too. | |
Heck I've never even used Haskell. | |
09:36 *** JanxSpirit QUIT Quit: JanxSpirit | |
09:37 <ddellacosta> quizdr: you are in Singapore? Are you doing | |
Clojure there? I worked there for a short | |
period when I was at my last company (based in | |
Tokyo). | |
09:37 *** JanxSpirit JOIN | |
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09:37 <quizdr> i'm in Singapore for about 2 years now. but my work | |
is in C++ (unfortunately). Clojure is strictly a | |
hobby for now | |
09:38 <quizdr> see yalls later | |
09:38 <chare> don't fight the anger I let out all the rage | |
09:38 *** divyansr QUIT Client Quit | |
09:38 <luxbock> arrdem: hmm it's never worked for me for some | |
reason, but my org-setup is fairly customized so | |
might be because of that | |
09:39 *** ToBeReplaced JOIN | |
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09:39 <ddellacosta> quizdr: gotcha, enjoy | |
09:39 <arrdem> luxbock: it turns out that mobile-org has some | |
import-export work that needs to be done | |
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09:39 *** VFe_ QUIT Read error: Operation timed out | |
09:39 <arrdem> luxbock: it initially wasn't working for me either | |
but after some bludgeoning it submitted | |
09:40 *** tomjoro QUIT Ping timeout: 276 seconds | |
09:40 <ddellacosta> matt444: what happens if you get rid of the | |
close! ? | |
09:40 <luxbock> maybe I'll give it another go later today | |
09:40 *** dacc QUIT Ping timeout: 245 seconds | |
09:40 <matt444> @ddellacosta: same result | |
09:40 *** JanxSpirit QUIT Client Quit | |
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09:41 <arrdem> luxbock: | |
http://stackoverflow.com/questions/8432108/how-to-automatically-do-org-mobile-push-org-mobile-pull-in-emacs | |
09:41 <arrdem> luxbock: | |
http://orgmode.org/manual/MobileOrg.html#MobileOrg | |
09:41 *** calumet QUIT Quit: Leaving. | |
09:41 <ddellacosta> matt444: what result do you get by the way? | |
09:41 [arrdem takes off his emacs pusher hat] | |
09:41 <matt444> ddellacosta: 3 | |
09:42 *** tbaldridge QUIT Remote host closed the connection | |
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09:42 *** ne-on JOIN | |
09:42 <luxbock> are you storing your org-files in Dropbox only or | |
are you using symlinks? | |
09:43 <arrdem> luxbock: I have everything treed out in ~/doc and | |
symlinked from ~/Dropbox to whatever I wanted DB to | |
sync for me | |
09:43 <arrdem> worked a treat | |
09:43 *** bkearns QUIT Quit: Leaving. | |
09:43 <arrdem> once I set up matching symlinks on all my boxes | |
09:43 <luxbock> alright, I'll give it another go later today, | |
thanks for the links | |
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09:45 <ddellacosta> matt444: not positive but I suspect you'll have | |
to call <! multiple times to get all the values | |
out of the merged channel. You may try to put | |
that last line in a (while true ...) loop. | |
09:45 *** jimduey JOIN | |
09:45 <matt444> ddellacosta: yes, i think you're right | |
09:45 *** marcopolo` JOIN | |
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09:47 <ddellacosta> matt444: ah, except by just looping through it, | |
you'll just call map over and over, so that | |
won't work. You probably will need to merge | |
the channels outside of a while loop, then try | |
pulling from the merged channel inside the | |
loop. | |
09:48 *** josephwilk QUIT Ping timeout: 245 seconds | |
09:48 <ddellacosta> again, not positive; haven't used merge much | |
and not confident I grasp the semantics of it | |
fully | |
09:48 <ddellacosta> not much = not at all | |
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10:04 <squidz> i'm trying to make a function faster in | |
clojurescript. The funciton uses assoc which seems | |
to slowing it down. Does anybody know a faster way | |
to implement this? Here is the funciton | |
https://www.refheap.com/24094 | |
10:05 *** jimduey JOIN | |
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Emacs) | |
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10:08 <squidz> it takes a map and one of the maps keys(group key), | |
then returns a new map where every key is combined | |
with the selected 'group key' | |
10:08 <AimHere> squidz, I don't know if it'll be faster, but you | |
tried zipmap? | |
10:09 *** teslanick QUIT Quit: Leaving. | |
10:09 *** carif QUIT Read error: Connection reset by peer | |
10:09 <AimHere> Something like (zipmap (map #(str k group-name) | |
(keys m)) (vals m)) | |
10:09 <dnolen> squidz: also might be faster to use (into {} ...) as | |
that will use transients | |
10:09 <AimHere> You might need to change the name of the 'map' | |
argument | |
10:10 *** carif JOIN | |
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10:10 <squidz> i'll try it with into and zipmap to see if that | |
helps | |
10:10 <dnolen> squidz: how big is the map? | |
10:11 *** jimduey JOIN | |
10:11 <squidz> around 15-20 key values, but that is being called | |
around 700 times | |
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10:12 *** nlew QUIT Ping timeout: 272 seconds | |
10:13 <AimHere> Oh, note that there's a 'reduce-kv' function for | |
the sort of job you're doing | |
10:13 *** jimduey QUIT Client Quit | |
10:13 <AimHere> (reduce-kv (fn [m k v] ... ) instead of the syntax | |
you were using | |
10:13 *** jonhinson QUIT Ping timeout: 246 seconds | |
10:14 <AimHere> Hang on, calling a function 700 times on 20 sets of | |
keys? | |
10:14 *** mercwithamouth JOIN | |
10:15 <AimHere> So each time this is happening, you're morphing a | |
key and then associng it back in place, taking | |
whatever performance penalties for deleting and | |
inserting a key? | |
10:15 *** calumet JOIN | |
10:16 <AimHere> For each key, can you fix it that you're doing all | |
the mutations at once? You'd be saving 680 hash | |
lookups | |
10:17 *** ttkk JOIN | |
10:18 <dnolen> squidz: how long is that taking (and under what | |
circumstances?) | |
10:19 *** firesofmay QUIT Ping timeout: 252 seconds | |
10:19 <egghead> dnolen: you should link to kioo in the om readme :) | |
10:19 <dnolen> egghead: thx for the reminder will do | |
10:20 *** Clome QUIT Read error: Operation timed out | |
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10:24 <squidz> dnolen: right now it is taking around 3 seconds. | |
What I am actually trying to do is given an array of | |
maps, I want to transform so that the array shortens | |
and the maps gain extra keys. I basicallly group by | |
a key then for each of those gorups I output a map | |
with combinations of that key with the remaining | |
keys in the map. Here is all the code for an example | |
https://www.refheap.com/24096 | |
10:25 <dnolen> squidz: 3 seconds? on what browser? | |
10:25 <dnolen> squidz: I just made a map of 20 keys and I could run | |
your function 700 times in ~45ms | |
10:25 *** teslanick JOIN | |
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10:27 *** thoughtmanifest JOIN | |
10:28 <squidz> on chrome. Let me give you a cljsfiddle | |
http://cljsfiddle.net/fiddle/beandipper.datameld | |
10:29 <squidz> it may be the other funcitons that call it | |
10:29 *** piranha JOIN | |
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10:29 <dnolen> squidz: even using your last refheap it takes < 30ms | |
for 700 runs of meld-data | |
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10:32 <squidz> dnolen: here is chromes flame chart | |
http://imgur.com/GLnb580 | |
10:33 *** tbaldridge JOIN | |
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10:34 *** miql NICK watsgoo | |
10:34 <squidz> for me the input for meld-data has 672 maps, each | |
map having the length 13 | |
10:35 *** kalloc QUIT Ping timeout: 272 seconds | |
10:35 <dnolen> squidz: that's not a particularly informative flame | |
chart w/o more information | |
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10:36 <squidz> dnolen: do you want the input data? | |
10:36 <dnolen> squidz: that would help considerably | |
10:36 <dnolen> squidz: what optimization settings here? advanced? | |
10:37 *** G0SUB JOIN | |
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10:40 <squidz> dnolen: simple optimization here is the data | |
http://pastebin.com/5TTxj2rm | |
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10:42 <jcromartie> dear god, I've been trying to make this huge | |
refactor all day and I'm just now finally | |
getting the REPL to start…? maybe? | |
10:42 <jcromartie> I suck | |
10:42 <dnolen> squidz: that's not EDN, are you calling clj->js | |
inside the loop? | |
10:42 *** jweiss QUIT Ping timeout: 252 seconds | |
10:42 *** ztellman JOIN | |
10:42 <dnolen> squidz: er js->clj | |
10:42 <warz> hi all. new to clojure here. when writing a lib, like | |
clj-http, is everything in `client.clj` visible to my | |
app, or is there a way to export only certain | |
functions, etc? | |
10:42 <warz> looks like everything is public, if you will | |
10:43 <squidz> I am feeding the data like data -> js->clj -> | |
meld-data | |
10:43 <squidz> so only once before the call of meld-data | |
10:43 <dnolen> squidz: k trying it out here | |
10:44 *** juxovec JOIN | |
10:46 <jcromartie> phew, it compiles finally | |
10:46 <jcromartie> I know I should have done it in bite-size pieces | |
10:46 <jcromartie> but, records... | |
10:47 *** G0SUB QUIT Read error: Connection reset by peer | |
10:47 *** thoughtmanifest QUIT Quit: Leaving. | |
10:47 <jcromartie> if I could just listen to technomancy... | |
10:47 [technomancy warns jcromartie about stairs] | |
10:47 *** G0SUB JOIN | |
!!! b3bai.com: connection broken by remote peer (closed) | |
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