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March 14, 2012 01:39
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Liskov philosophy and structure
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| } --></style><style><!-- html, body, body[type], body.normal, body.console {font-family:'Inconsolata';font-size:12.000000pt;} --></style></head><body class="normal" type="channel" channelname="#mendicant-webdev-3" style="overflow-x: hidden; "><div id="topic"></div><div highlight="false" alternate="even" class="line event" type="system" id="line0"><span class="time">08:28 </span><span class="message" type="system">You have joined the channel</span></div><div highlight="false" alternate="odd" class="line event" type="join" id="line1"><span class="time duptime">08:28 </span><span class="message" type="join">seejee has joined (~seejee@<span class="address" oncontextmenu="on_addr()">pool-96-236-148-17.pitbpa.fios.verizon.net</span>)</span></div><div highlight="false" alternate="even" class="line event" type="reply" id="line2"><span class="time duptime">08:28 </span><span class="message" type="reply">Mode: +cntk sparklyunicorns</span></div><div highlight="false" alternate="odd" class="line event" type="reply" id="line3"><span class="time duptime">08:28 </span><span class="message" type="reply">Created at: Mar 6, 2012 1:39 PM</span></div><div highlight="false" alternate="even" class="line event" type="join" id="line4"><span class="time">09:32 </span><span class="message" type="join">bglusman has joined (~bglusman@<span class="address" oncontextmenu="on_addr()">c-68-80-200-61.hsd1.pa.comcast.net</span>)</span></div><div highlight="false" alternate="odd" class="line event" type="quit" id="line5"><span class="time">15:04 </span><span class="message" type="quit">hierbabuena has left IRC (Quit: Leaving...)</span></div><div highlight="false" alternate="even" class="line event" type="join" id="line6"><span class="time">15:12 </span><span class="message" type="join">hierbabuena has joined (~Nerian@<span class="address" oncontextmenu="on_addr()">161.Red-88-8-92.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net</span>)</span></div><div highlight="false" alternate="odd" class="line event" type="join" id="line7"><span class="time">15:28 </span><span class="message" type="join">justinram has joined (~justinram@<span class="address" oncontextmenu="on_addr()">94-194-91-146.zone8.bethere.co.uk</span>)</span></div><div highlight="false" alternate="even" class="line event" type="quit" id="line8"><span class="time">17:30 </span><span class="message" type="quit">hierbabuena has left IRC (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)</span></div><div highlight="false" alternate="odd" class="line event" type="quit" id="line9"><span class="time">17:37 </span><span class="message" type="quit">bglusman has left IRC (Remote host closed the connection)</span></div><div highlight="false" alternate="even" class="line event" type="join" id="line10"><span class="time">18:25 </span><span class="message" type="join">bglusman has joined (~bglusman@<span class="address" oncontextmenu="on_addr()">pool-108-16-164-165.phlapa.east.verizon.net</span>)</span></div><div highlight="false" alternate="odd" class="line event" type="quit" id="line11"><span class="time">18:54 </span><span class="message" type="quit">tehviking has left IRC (Ping timeout: 265 seconds)</span></div><div highlight="false" alternate="even" class="line event" type="quit" id="line12"><span class="time">18:55 </span><span class="message" type="quit">notbrent has left IRC (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)</span></div><div highlight="false" alternate="odd" class="line event" type="join" id="line13"><span class="time">19:01 </span><span class="message" type="join">notbrent has joined (u5121@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-oqlvytsxyhlvtftp)</span></div><div highlight="false" alternate="even" class="line event" type="join" id="line14"><span class="time">19:33 </span><span class="message" type="join">tehviking has joined (u2893@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-fvxsoqqmrphrvyau)</span></div><div highlight="false" alternate="odd" class="line event" type="quit" id="line15"><span class="time">19:59 </span><span class="message" type="quit">jordanbyron has left IRC (Quit: Leaving.)</span></div><div highlight="false" alternate="even" class="line event" type="quit" id="line16"><span class="time">20:31 </span><span class="message" type="quit">justinram has left IRC (Remote host closed the connection)</span></div><div highlight="false" alternate="odd" class="line event" type="join" id="line17"><span class="time">20:33 </span><span class="message" type="join">jordanbyron has joined (~jordanbyr@<span class="address" oncontextmenu="on_addr()">ool-4357d07c.dyn.optonline.net</span>)</span></div><div highlight="false" alternate="even" class="line event" type="quit" id="line18"><span class="time">21:01 </span><span class="message" type="quit">bglusman has left IRC (Remote host closed the connection)</span></div><div highlight="false" alternate="odd" nick="seejee" class="line text" type="privmsg" id="line19"><span class="time">21:02 </span><span class="sender" type="myself" oncontextmenu="on_nick()" identified="true" first="true">seejee </span><span class="message" type="privmsg">seacreature: would it be easier to discuss project 5 in here? :)</span></div><div highlight="true" alternate="even" nick="seacreature" class="line text" type="privmsg" id="line20"><span class="time">21:05 </span><span class="sender" type="normal" oncontextmenu="on_nick()" identified="false" colornumber="15" first="true">seacreature </span><span class="message" type="privmsg"><strong class="highlight">seejee</strong>: maybe so</span></div><div highlight="false" alternate="odd" nick="seejee" class="line text" type="privmsg" id="line21"><span class="time">21:06 </span><span class="sender" type="myself" oncontextmenu="on_nick()" identified="true" first="true">seejee </span><span class="message" type="privmsg">seacreature: i'm good now, with your latest email</span></div><div highlight="false" alternate="even" nick="seejee" class="line text" type="privmsg" id="line22"><span class="time duptime">21:06 </span><span class="sender" type="myself" oncontextmenu="on_nick()" identified="true" first="false">seejee </span><span class="message" type="privmsg">a course has tasks, and a student has many completed tasks</span></div><div highlight="false" alternate="odd" nick="seejee" class="line text" type="privmsg" id="line23"><span class="time duptime">21:06 </span><span class="sender" type="myself" oncontextmenu="on_nick()" identified="true" first="false">seejee </span><span class="message" type="privmsg">got it</span></div><div highlight="false" alternate="even" nick="seacreature" class="line text" type="privmsg" id="line24"><span class="time duptime">21:06 </span><span class="sender" type="normal" oncontextmenu="on_nick()" identified="false" colornumber="15" first="true">seacreature </span><span class="message" type="privmsg">I'm thinking we may want to make the tasks a bit more fleshed out, like a sentence instead of a couple words.</span></div><div highlight="false" alternate="odd" nick="seacreature" class="line text" type="privmsg" id="line25"><span class="time">21:07 </span><span class="sender" type="normal" oncontextmenu="on_nick()" identified="false" colornumber="15" first="false">seacreature </span><span class="message" type="privmsg">hmm... having trouble deciding what that would look like :-/</span></div><div highlight="false" alternate="even" nick="seacreature" class="line text" type="privmsg" id="line26"><span class="time">21:08 </span><span class="sender" type="normal" oncontextmenu="on_nick()" identified="false" colornumber="15" first="false">seacreature </span><span class="message" type="privmsg">so scratch that for now</span></div><div highlight="false" alternate="odd" nick="seejee" class="line text" type="privmsg" id="line27"><span class="time duptime">21:08 </span><span class="sender" type="myself" oncontextmenu="on_nick()" identified="true" first="true">seejee </span><span class="message" type="privmsg">ok</span></div><div highlight="false" alternate="even" nick="seacreature" class="line text" type="privmsg" id="line28"><span class="time duptime">21:08 </span><span class="sender" type="normal" oncontextmenu="on_nick()" identified="false" colornumber="15" first="true">seacreature </span><span class="message" type="privmsg">the idea is that the notion of "exercises" exists only in the free-form description of the course now</span></div><div highlight="false" alternate="odd" nick="seacreature" class="line text" type="privmsg" id="line29"><span class="time duptime">21:08 </span><span class="sender" type="normal" oncontextmenu="on_nick()" identified="false" colornumber="15" first="false">seacreature </span><span class="message" type="privmsg">so we wouldn't have a task like "challenge exercise"</span></div><div highlight="false" alternate="even" nick="seacreature" class="line text" type="privmsg" id="line30"><span class="time">21:09 </span><span class="sender" type="normal" oncontextmenu="on_nick()" identified="false" colornumber="15" first="false">seacreature </span><span class="message" type="privmsg">I think to make this all make sense, we're probably going to need to discuss the planned changes to the core course eventually :)</span></div><div highlight="false" alternate="odd" nick="seejee" class="line text" type="privmsg" id="line31"><span class="time">21:10 </span><span class="sender" type="myself" oncontextmenu="on_nick()" identified="true" first="true">seejee </span><span class="message" type="privmsg">I agree. I know I'm definitely trying to map my experience in the core skills course onto this</span></div><div highlight="false" alternate="even" nick="seacreature" class="line text" type="privmsg" id="line32"><span class="time duptime">21:10 </span><span class="sender" type="normal" oncontextmenu="on_nick()" identified="false" colornumber="15" first="true">seacreature </span><span class="message" type="privmsg">in future core skills sessions we're going to be doing away with specific checkpoints in favor of weekly interviews</span></div><div highlight="false" alternate="odd" nick="seacreature" class="line text" type="privmsg" id="line33"><span class="time duptime">21:10 </span><span class="sender" type="normal" oncontextmenu="on_nick()" identified="false" colornumber="15" first="false">seacreature </span><span class="message" type="privmsg">so the idea is that student progress report lists all the requirements for completing the course</span></div><div highlight="false" alternate="even" nick="seacreature" class="line text" type="privmsg" id="line34"><span class="time">21:11 </span><span class="sender" type="normal" oncontextmenu="on_nick()" identified="false" colornumber="15" first="false">seacreature </span><span class="message" type="privmsg">and by the end of the course that will be all completed if the student successfully completes the course</span></div><div highlight="false" alternate="odd" nick="seacreature" class="line text" type="privmsg" id="line35"><span class="time">21:12 </span><span class="sender" type="normal" oncontextmenu="on_nick()" identified="false" colornumber="15" first="false">seacreature </span><span class="message" type="privmsg">but there isn't going to be this notion of "progressing", "functional", "approved", etc</span></div><div highlight="false" alternate="even" nick="seejee" class="line text" type="privmsg" id="line36"><span class="time duptime">21:12 </span><span class="sender" type="myself" oncontextmenu="on_nick()" identified="true" first="true">seejee </span><span class="message" type="privmsg">I see. And the minutes or action items that come out of each interview will be captured on the student's plan page?</span></div><div highlight="false" alternate="odd" nick="seacreature" class="line text" type="privmsg" id="line37"><span class="time duptime">21:12 </span><span class="sender" type="normal" oncontextmenu="on_nick()" identified="false" colornumber="15" first="true">seacreature </span><span class="message" type="privmsg">exactly. Each interview will cause the plan to be updated</span></div><div highlight="false" alternate="even" nick="seejee" class="line text" type="privmsg" id="line38"><span class="time">21:13 </span><span class="sender" type="myself" oncontextmenu="on_nick()" identified="true" first="true">seejee </span><span class="message" type="privmsg">but the course's tasks requirements are the same for every student in a given course?</span></div><div highlight="false" alternate="odd" nick="seacreature" class="line text" type="privmsg" id="line39"><span class="time duptime">21:13 </span><span class="sender" type="normal" oncontextmenu="on_nick()" identified="false" colornumber="15" first="true">seacreature </span><span class="message" type="privmsg">That's correct.</span></div><div highlight="false" alternate="even" nick="seacreature" class="line text" type="privmsg" id="line40"><span class="time duptime">21:13 </span><span class="sender" type="normal" oncontextmenu="on_nick()" identified="false" colornumber="15" first="false">seacreature </span><span class="message" type="privmsg">Given the webdev course as an example, it'd probably read "Individual Project", "Group Project"</span></div><div highlight="false" alternate="odd" nick="seacreature" class="line text" type="privmsg" id="line41"><span class="time">21:14 </span><span class="sender" type="normal" oncontextmenu="on_nick()" identified="false" colornumber="15" first="false">seacreature </span><span class="message" type="privmsg">and when you completed the group project, your description would probably be: "Liskov student page"</span></div><div highlight="false" alternate="even" nick="seacreature" class="line text" type="privmsg" id="line42"><span class="time">21:15 </span><span class="sender" type="normal" oncontextmenu="on_nick()" identified="false" colornumber="15" first="false">seacreature </span><span class="message" type="privmsg">or "Feature Set <span class="channel" oncontextmenu="on_chname()">#5"</span> if we wanted to be formal</span></div><div highlight="false" alternate="odd" nick="seejee" class="line text" type="privmsg" id="line43"><span class="time duptime">21:15 </span><span class="sender" type="myself" oncontextmenu="on_nick()" identified="true" first="true">seejee </span><span class="message" type="privmsg">so only at the time of completing a task do you want to update the task description for that student?</span></div><div highlight="false" alternate="even" nick="seacreature" class="line text" type="privmsg" id="line44"><span class="time">21:16 </span><span class="sender" type="normal" oncontextmenu="on_nick()" identified="false" colornumber="15" first="true">seacreature </span><span class="message" type="privmsg">yeah, that's what I have in mind</span></div><div highlight="false" alternate="odd" nick="seejee" class="line text" type="privmsg" id="line45"><span class="time duptime">21:16 </span><span class="sender" type="myself" oncontextmenu="on_nick()" identified="true" first="true">seejee </span><span class="message" type="privmsg">ok, that really helps</span></div><div highlight="false" alternate="even" nick="seejee" class="line text" type="privmsg" id="line46"><span class="time">21:17 </span><span class="sender" type="myself" oncontextmenu="on_nick()" identified="true" first="false">seejee </span><span class="message" type="privmsg">i'll capture this log so vinicius can see it as well</span></div><div highlight="false" alternate="odd" nick="seacreature" class="line text" type="privmsg" id="line47"><span class="time duptime">21:17 </span><span class="sender" type="normal" oncontextmenu="on_nick()" identified="false" colornumber="15" first="true">seacreature </span><span class="message" type="privmsg">I'm not sure whether this behavior is going to be what I want in the end, but I want to try it.</span></div><div highlight="false" alternate="even" nick="seacreature" class="line text" type="privmsg" id="line48"><span class="time">21:18 </span><span class="sender" type="normal" oncontextmenu="on_nick()" identified="false" colornumber="15" first="false">seacreature </span><span class="message" type="privmsg">let me share a google doc that explains why I want this, it's what shane and I always end up making during the courses</span></div><div highlight="false" alternate="odd" nick="seacreature" class="line text" type="privmsg" id="line49"><span class="time duptime">21:18 </span><span class="sender" type="normal" oncontextmenu="on_nick()" identified="false" colornumber="15" first="false">seacreature </span><span class="message" type="privmsg">which tells us the "progress report" isn't doing its job in uni-web</span></div><div highlight="false" alternate="even" nick="seacreature" class="line text" type="privmsg" id="line50"><span class="time">21:19 </span><span class="sender" type="normal" oncontextmenu="on_nick()" identified="false" colornumber="15" first="false">seacreature </span><span class="message" type="privmsg"><a href="https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0AjkBKEXbo6n8dG1VVmlNZUlybmhvV2pTaHRwTENseEE" class="url" oncontextmenu="on_url()">https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0AjkBKEXbo6n8dG1VVmlNZUlybmhvV2pTaHRwTENseEE</a></span></div><div highlight="false" alternate="odd" nick="seejee" class="line text" type="privmsg" id="line51"><span class="time">21:20 </span><span class="sender" type="myself" oncontextmenu="on_nick()" identified="true" first="true">seejee </span><span class="message" type="privmsg">I see</span></div><div highlight="false" alternate="even" nick="seacreature" class="line text" type="privmsg" id="line52"><span class="time duptime">21:20 </span><span class="sender" type="normal" oncontextmenu="on_nick()" identified="false" colornumber="15" first="true">seacreature </span><span class="message" type="privmsg">we always make this mapping of the requirements to the projects actually worked on</span></div><div highlight="false" alternate="odd" nick="seacreature" class="line text" type="privmsg" id="line53"><span class="time duptime">21:20 </span><span class="sender" type="normal" oncontextmenu="on_nick()" identified="false" colornumber="15" first="false">seacreature </span><span class="message" type="privmsg">so the new progress report is going to be exactly that</span></div><div highlight="false" alternate="even" nick="seejee" class="line text" type="privmsg" id="line54"><span class="time duptime">21:20 </span><span class="sender" type="myself" oncontextmenu="on_nick()" identified="true" first="true">seejee </span><span class="message" type="privmsg">that makes sense</span></div><div highlight="false" alternate="odd" nick="seejee" class="line text" type="privmsg" id="line55"><span class="time">21:21 </span><span class="sender" type="myself" oncontextmenu="on_nick()" identified="true" first="false">seejee </span><span class="message" type="privmsg">maybe I'm wrong, but I would think you'd want to see what project each student is working on for each task before it's completed</span></div><div highlight="true" alternate="even" nick="seacreature" class="line text" type="privmsg" id="line56"><span class="time duptime">21:21 </span><span class="sender" type="normal" oncontextmenu="on_nick()" identified="false" colornumber="15" first="true">seacreature </span><span class="message" type="privmsg"><strong class="highlight">seejee</strong>: that information will be in the student plan</span></div><div highlight="false" alternate="odd" nick="seejee" class="line text" type="privmsg" id="line57"><span class="time duptime">21:21 </span><span class="sender" type="myself" oncontextmenu="on_nick()" identified="true" first="true">seejee </span><span class="message" type="privmsg">ok</span></div><div highlight="false" alternate="even" nick="seacreature" class="line text" type="privmsg" id="line58"><span class="time">21:22 </span><span class="sender" type="normal" oncontextmenu="on_nick()" identified="false" colornumber="15" first="true">seacreature </span><span class="message" type="privmsg">let me create a sample plan using your data as an example</span></div><div highlight="false" alternate="odd" nick="seejee" class="line text" type="privmsg" id="line59"><span class="time">21:24 </span><span class="sender" type="myself" oncontextmenu="on_nick()" identified="true" first="true">seejee </span><span class="message" type="privmsg">and that's why you want the progress report to link to the plan page, and not the student page</span></div><div highlight="false" alternate="even" nick="seejee" class="line text" type="privmsg" id="line60"><span class="time">21:25 </span><span class="sender" type="myself" oncontextmenu="on_nick()" identified="true" first="false">seejee </span><span class="message" type="privmsg">the progress report let's you see, at a glance, who hasn't complete a given task</span></div><div highlight="false" alternate="odd" nick="seejee" class="line text" type="privmsg" id="line61"><span class="time duptime">21:25 </span><span class="sender" type="myself" oncontextmenu="on_nick()" identified="true" first="false">seejee </span><span class="message" type="privmsg">so you jump over to their plan to see they're working on towards it, plus any important info about it that came out of the interviews</span></div><div highlight="false" alternate="even" nick="seejee" class="line text" type="privmsg" id="line62"><span class="time">21:26 </span><span class="sender" type="myself" oncontextmenu="on_nick()" identified="true" first="false">seejee </span><span class="message" type="privmsg">s/to see they're/to see what they're/</span></div><div highlight="false" alternate="odd" nick="seacreature" class="line text" type="privmsg" id="line63"><span class="time">21:27 </span><span class="sender" type="normal" oncontextmenu="on_nick()" identified="false" colornumber="15" first="true">seacreature </span><span class="message" type="privmsg"><a href="https://gist.github.com/8671c35f4db02d01f947" class="url" oncontextmenu="on_url()">https://gist.github.com/8671c35f4db02d01f947</a></span></div><div highlight="false" alternate="even" nick="seacreature" class="line text" type="privmsg" id="line64"><span class="time duptime">21:27 </span><span class="sender" type="normal" oncontextmenu="on_nick()" identified="false" colornumber="15" first="false">seacreature </span><span class="message" type="privmsg">that's correct</span></div><div highlight="false" alternate="odd" nick="seacreature" class="line text" type="privmsg" id="line65"><span class="time duptime">21:27 </span><span class="sender" type="normal" oncontextmenu="on_nick()" identified="false" colornumber="15" first="false">seacreature </span><span class="message" type="privmsg">there will also be a link to the plan page on every conversation started by the student</span></div><div highlight="false" alternate="even" nick="seacreature" class="line text" type="privmsg" id="line66"><span class="time">21:28 </span><span class="sender" type="normal" oncontextmenu="on_nick()" identified="false" colornumber="15" first="false">seacreature </span><span class="message" type="privmsg">I really need to have a lot more of an integrated view of what a student is working on than what university-web currently supports</span></div><div highlight="false" alternate="odd" nick="seacreature" class="line text" type="privmsg" id="line67"><span class="time duptime">21:28 </span><span class="sender" type="normal" oncontextmenu="on_nick()" identified="false" colornumber="15" first="false">seacreature </span><span class="message" type="privmsg">because any suggestion I make needs to be in the context of how things are going across the whole course, not just on a single project</span></div><div highlight="false" alternate="even" nick="seejee" class="line text" type="privmsg" id="line68"><span class="time">21:29 </span><span class="sender" type="myself" oncontextmenu="on_nick()" identified="true" first="true">seejee </span><span class="message" type="privmsg">right, and trying to model it explicitly is probably too restrictive, hence the free-form markdown plan</span></div><div highlight="false" alternate="odd" nick="seacreature" class="line text" type="privmsg" id="line69"><span class="time duptime">21:29 </span><span class="sender" type="normal" oncontextmenu="on_nick()" identified="false" colornumber="15" first="true">seacreature </span><span class="message" type="privmsg">in the core course especially, this is a challenge without having a single unified plan</span></div><div highlight="false" alternate="even" nick="seacreature" class="line text" type="privmsg" id="line70"><span class="time duptime">21:29 </span><span class="sender" type="normal" oncontextmenu="on_nick()" identified="false" colornumber="15" first="false">seacreature </span><span class="message" type="privmsg">Exactly. At the very least I want to see what conventions emerge before codifying them</span></div><div highlight="false" alternate="odd" nick="seejee" class="line text" type="privmsg" id="line71"><span class="time duptime">21:29 </span><span class="sender" type="myself" oncontextmenu="on_nick()" identified="true" first="true">seejee </span><span class="message" type="privmsg">ok, this really, really helps</span></div><div highlight="false" alternate="even" nick="seacreature" class="line text" type="privmsg" id="line72"><span class="time duptime">21:29 </span><span class="sender" type="normal" oncontextmenu="on_nick()" identified="false" colornumber="15" first="true">seacreature </span><span class="message" type="privmsg">this system involves more manual labor than what I'll be comfortable with. That's by design</span></div><div highlight="false" alternate="odd" nick="seacreature" class="line text" type="privmsg" id="line73"><span class="time">21:30 </span><span class="sender" type="normal" oncontextmenu="on_nick()" identified="false" colornumber="15" first="false">seacreature </span><span class="message" type="privmsg">because right now university-web is a collection of single-application kitchen appliances</span></div><div highlight="false" alternate="even" nick="seacreature" class="line text" type="privmsg" id="line74"><span class="time duptime">21:30 </span><span class="sender" type="normal" oncontextmenu="on_nick()" identified="false" colornumber="15" first="false">seacreature </span><span class="message" type="privmsg">and that's why it has so many features that aren't very cohesive with one another</span></div><div highlight="false" alternate="odd" nick="seacreature" class="line text" type="privmsg" id="line75"><span class="time">21:31 </span><span class="sender" type="normal" oncontextmenu="on_nick()" identified="false" colornumber="15" first="false">seacreature </span><span class="message" type="privmsg">So liskov is tipping the scales to the other extreme, in the hopes that it's easier to add explicit models later for the things that are truly common</span></div><div highlight="false" alternate="even" nick="seejee" class="line text" type="privmsg" id="line76"><span class="time duptime">21:31 </span><span class="sender" type="myself" oncontextmenu="on_nick()" identified="true" first="true">seejee </span><span class="message" type="privmsg">right so build a very malleable system, and see what can be automated in a cohesive manner in the future?</span></div><div highlight="false" alternate="odd" nick="seacreature" class="line text" type="privmsg" id="line77"><span class="time duptime">21:31 </span><span class="sender" type="normal" oncontextmenu="on_nick()" identified="false" colornumber="15" first="true">seacreature </span><span class="message" type="privmsg">exactly.</span></div><div highlight="false" alternate="even" nick="seejee" class="line text" type="privmsg" id="line78"><span class="time duptime">21:31 </span><span class="sender" type="myself" oncontextmenu="on_nick()" identified="true" first="true">seejee </span><span class="message" type="privmsg">got it</span></div><div highlight="false" alternate="odd" nick="seejee" class="line text" type="privmsg" id="line79"><span class="time duptime">21:31 </span><span class="sender" type="myself" oncontextmenu="on_nick()" identified="true" first="false">seejee </span><span class="message" type="privmsg">I apologize for not asking about the intent of the system in detail first</span></div><div highlight="false" alternate="even" nick="seejee" class="line text" type="privmsg" id="line80"><span class="time duptime">21:31 </span><span class="sender" type="myself" oncontextmenu="on_nick()" identified="true" first="false">seejee </span><span class="message" type="privmsg">i think we churned a lot because we tried to dig into the technical bits before understanding the system's intent or behavior</span></div><div highlight="false" alternate="odd" nick="seacreature" class="line text" type="privmsg" id="line81"><span class="time">21:32 </span><span class="sender" type="normal" oncontextmenu="on_nick()" identified="false" colornumber="15" first="true">seacreature </span><span class="message" type="privmsg">No worries, we didn't exactly present this information clearly. You've been doing a great job of shaking the requirements out</span></div><div highlight="false" alternate="even" nick="seacreature" class="line text" type="privmsg" id="line82"><span class="time duptime">21:32 </span><span class="sender" type="normal" oncontextmenu="on_nick()" identified="false" colornumber="15" first="false">seacreature </span><span class="message" type="privmsg">yeah, I felt a bit of that across the board, but it's part of what we're practicing/studying here anyway</span></div><div highlight="false" alternate="odd" nick="seacreature" class="line text" type="privmsg" id="line83"><span class="time">21:33 </span><span class="sender" type="normal" oncontextmenu="on_nick()" identified="false" colornumber="15" first="false">seacreature </span><span class="message" type="privmsg">I was really impressed that we got things sorted relatively quickly. Distributing work across 10 people isn't easy, especially considering that the first mocks ever for this new system were generated the day before the course</span></div><div highlight="false" alternate="even" nick="seacreature" class="line text" type="privmsg" id="line84"><span class="time duptime">21:33 </span><span class="sender" type="normal" oncontextmenu="on_nick()" identified="false" colornumber="15" first="false">seacreature </span><span class="message" type="privmsg">but we figured this would maximize the realism of the session, even if it naturally increased the confusion, too</span></div><div highlight="false" alternate="odd" nick="seejee" class="line text" type="privmsg" id="line85"><span class="time">21:34 </span><span class="sender" type="myself" oncontextmenu="on_nick()" identified="true" first="true">seejee </span><span class="message" type="privmsg">i really like it, because this feels very much like the "real world"</span></div><div highlight="false" alternate="even" nick="seejee" class="line text" type="privmsg" id="line86"><span class="time duptime">21:34 </span><span class="sender" type="myself" oncontextmenu="on_nick()" identified="true" first="false">seejee </span><span class="message" type="privmsg">and distilling requirements is something I can always get better at</span></div><div highlight="false" alternate="odd" nick="seacreature" class="line text" type="privmsg" id="line87"><span class="time">21:35 </span><span class="sender" type="normal" oncontextmenu="on_nick()" identified="false" colornumber="15" first="true">seacreature </span><span class="message" type="privmsg">there are two things I think will make understanding this new system a lot easier</span></div><div highlight="false" alternate="even" nick="seacreature" class="line text" type="privmsg" id="line88"><span class="time">21:36 </span><span class="sender" type="normal" oncontextmenu="on_nick()" identified="false" colornumber="15" first="false">seacreature </span><span class="message" type="privmsg">1) it's not university-web 2.0, it's a reimagining of how we do course management. It will serve the same *purpose* of university-web, but not necessarily using the same paradigms. The new system has two years of knowledge/evolution in mind that university-web doesn't</span></div><div highlight="false" alternate="odd" nick="seacreature" class="line text" type="privmsg" id="line89"><span class="time duptime">21:36 </span><span class="sender" type="normal" oncontextmenu="on_nick()" identified="false" colornumber="15" first="false">seacreature </span><span class="message" type="privmsg">2) liskov serves two main users: the student and the instructor. Every feature needs to be evaluated from both sides simultaneously</span></div></body></html> |
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